09-04-2003 07:54									#151
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quote: Originally posted by Eli I'm too excited about all this. When is the war chat?

Maybe we start tomorrow night. Although if I do get the turn played tonight (it is 11pm edt here now) tomorrow will be anti-climactic. The real fun will start when the Immortals emerge from the mountains in a few turns.

	09-04-2003 07:57									#152
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quote: Originally posted by Wittlich Nbarclay's (GS) support of our "war" on Bob in the open forum is starting to make me feel guilty....Ah well, such is life...and war.

Yes - I know what you mean. But I know about some of the stuff they have said about us in chats with other teams - it ain't pretty. We are chump change as far as they are concerned. So - I don't feel all that bad.

One way or the other - this will be one for the ages.

So - question - what do we send in the way of coreespondence to GS. I suggest nothing. We shut it down completely and don't respond at all to them.

We let the Immortals do the talking.

	09-04-2003 23:51									#153
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I think we must fight and make peace on our terms. We are despotic, they are a republic. They will feel WW, not us. So we have the advantage in a longer war than them. I know they're religious, but WW is a pain the a.. for every civ.

If they want peace, they will have to come and get it...

--Kon--

	09-04-2003 23:53									#154
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I thought there isnt War Weariness in PBEM games?

	09-04-2003 23:59									#155
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I don't know... Why would that change? My experience with PBEM is too limited to answer this question exactly though...

	10-04-2003 00:55									#156
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I had heard the same thing. Since this is my first multiplayer game I do not know (and as desposts we are not going to find out any time soon). As far as WW goes I seldom have a problem with it in my SP games. Given that we are on a low difficulty level, GS has two luxuries, and their cities are small, I don't think WW will be much of a problem for them. Hopefully, the war will not last long enough for them to find out.

	25-04-2003 05:28									#157
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Just got this from Theseus in MZO Private Message.

quote: Kon, feel free to choose not to reply, but what's up with Vox??!! Our current theory is that given the magnitude of the turn, you guys are trying to arrange a chat concurrent with combat, so you can all figure out what to do together, turn by turn. Not so say I'm afraid / positive about the outcome, or fearful / dismissive of Immortals, or anything except I AM TEARING MY HAIR OUT IN ANTICIPATION!!!! Again, compliments to you and your team mates... a devilish strategy, and well played.

And I replied:

quote: You nailed it there... We wanted to set a war chat, bu poly died and you know the rest... It should be played soon though... Let the Immortals shine

I think we should play soon, as other teams are getting impatient. I think what Eli said in the Moves thread is great and we should follow that, although we could send 1 immortal to Monsoon, in case of a pikeman...

--Kon--

	25-04-2003 05:57									#158
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I concur with sending 1 immortal with the spearmen to take/raze Monsoon.

I wonder what they're thinking about GoW landing forces in their terrritory...

It's nice to hear that at least Theseus from GS apprieciates our strategy.

	15-05-2003 16:52									#159
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As per the moves thread - sent to nbarclay:

Hi nathan. Before going to work this morning, I checked the 550 bc save just received from RP. You have offered a peace treaty. Was this part of the recent crash fix, or did you have something else in mind?

Please advise. Thanks. ... Beta.

	15-05-2003 21:00									#160
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And his response:

RE: peace
It was an accident. I was using the diplomacy screen to do some spying of a sort, and apparently didn't back out all the way. Sorry about the inconvenience.

Nathan

	16-05-2003 03:05									#161
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

So I sent this back:

No inconvenience whatsover. But since it was on the screen, Vox is willing to consider a peace deal for 200 gold now, 10 gold per turn, feudalism, and Monsoon.
.... Beta.

	22-05-2003 16:16									#163
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OK - this is interesting. I had posted a quick quip in the public forum, in response to nye's comment about the 'peace loving Voxians'. I think it was in the "Who has the game save" thread.

Received this PM from nye this morning. Any thoughts? Changes of heart?

--------------------------------------

Your message
quote:
Originally posted by BetaHound


Well - at least someone on GS sees the light...


Beta.

We have been waiting to hear a proposal from Vox. Those of us disposed to listen to peace can do nothing else in it's absense.

nye

	22-05-2003 19:45									#164
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But what do they offer for peace? The last time we discussed peace GS demanded all territory south of Elipolis...and what did they offer in return? The "promise" to "give" us a supply of iron and the possibility of support for a campaign on Bob.

So, with this in mind, does NYE have a better proposal? Of course, I'm not holding my breath on a "better" offer.

	22-05-2003 19:47									#165
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Interesting. I believe there are some on GS who want peace. Are they strong enough to get it? What would they demand from us? What would peace get us? It might be interesting to pursue peace to see what might happen but I feel there is no chance for us to win this game as long as GS lives.

	22-05-2003 22:50									#166
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We shouldnt make any territorial concessions unlesss we're certain that they are capable and preparing to occupy those lands.

	26-05-2003 03:19									#167
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I agree

Jon Miller
- from Oregon

	27-05-2003 07:35									#168
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My note to buy us some time until we can confirm GoW;s commitment to this effort.

There may be a window for discussions from our end. We will document our proposals and table them. Regards ... Beta.

quote: notyoueither wrote on 22-05-2003 04:40: quote: Originally posted by BetaHound Well - at least someone on GS sees the light... Beta. We have been waiting to hear a proposal from Vox. Those of us disposed to listen to peace can do nothing else in it's absense. nye

	06-06-2003 05:07									#169
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OK - when the concensus was to try for peace - I responded to nye's earlier note. This is what I sent.

Re: Your message
Greetings nye. This is an official message from Vox. We would - ah - very much like to discuss the cessation of hostilities. There will be considerable bloodshed in the next few turns if we continue at war. Now - I admit - bloodshed is nothing new to us in this war - as we have done most of the shedding - but it might get particularly gruesome over the next few turns.

We also admit that you have us somewhat over a barrel here - (we are crying 'uncle' quietly) - so we are asking very politely and with humility for a peace discussion.

I will be around later this evening to discuss.

Sincerely - Beta.
quote:

notyoueither wrote on 22-05-2003 04:40:
quote:
Originally posted by BetaHound


Well - at least someone on GS sees the light...


Beta.

We have been waiting to hear a proposal from Vox. Those of us disposed to listen to peace can do nothing else in it's absense.

nye

	06-06-2003 05:08									#170
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Received from GS today:

Peace?
People of Vox:

Gathering Storm acknowledges your offer of peace. Be assured that Gathering Storm is considering it. Please understand that there are many in the Storm that will accept nothing less than an unconditional surrender. In other words peace on our terms, Are you still willing to talk peace?

We can't hold up the game discussing it, and so we played the turn. If you really want peace, may we suggest sending us a formal proposal, and using some of your teams time on the clock to do it, so that we may have time to properly discuss it (your time, plus the time between us, plus our time)? Please understand, however, that hostilities in the game will continue unless and until a formal deal is reached.


Regards
Mss, Ambassador to Vox
Gathering Storm

	06-06-2003 05:34									#171
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Greetings GS

In exchange for the cessation of hostilities

We here at Vox ackowledge that we started an injust and evil war and bare sole responsibility for results

We will hand over control of Vox trade to GS

We will accept Vassal status

Jon Miller

	06-06-2003 05:37									#172
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note, as we are now, the only way we will come back is if the other nations pound eachother and if we survive

the cessation of Vox trade will make it so that it is in GS's interests for Vox to be up in trade

the Vassal status because, well lets face it, I think that is what we will be (for a while) no matter what

the acknowledgement of fault is probably important to some individuals

I just hope we can keep from losing too much territory

Jon Miller

	06-06-2003 06:10									#173
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Interesting twist Jon...Did you send this proposal to GS?I wonder how GS will respond. It's definately and "interesting" proposal to say the least.

	06-06-2003 07:12									#174
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Jon - was that a suggestion - or as Witt has asked - a message to GS. We need to know.

At the same time - and as I write this - I am chatting with Lego. I have a vote of support - and iron from RP. Looking to chat with Gow later tonight.

And have written NeuD asking for horses.Sooner or later we will have to decide.

	06-06-2003 08:17									#175
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quote: Originally posted by Jon Miller Greetings GS In exchange for the cessation of hostilities We here at Vox ackowledge that we started an injust and evil war and bare sole responsibility for results We will hand over control of Vox trade to GS We will accept Vassal status Jon Miller

'unjust' and 'bear' and a few missing words.

Otherwise - well written for a physics guy.

j/k. Let's see where things go in the next couple of days. World support still appears to be behind us. But we need that to be translated into something tangible.

	06-06-2003 11:10									#176
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it was a suggestion

I had bear in the first time, should have gotten unjust also

Jon Miller

	06-06-2003 11:14									#177
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I would just like to get things going

both peace and war, so if war falls through we can make peace quickly

Jon Miller

	06-06-2003 16:28									#178
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quote: Originally posted by Jon Miller I would just like to get things going both peace and war, so if war falls through we can make peace quickly Jon Miller

Agreed.

	06-06-2003 17:00									#179
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My opening offer to GS, I didn't figure there was any benefit in hal-measures. It had to be significant.

Greetings MSS. There has been much discussion within Vox. We understand your position as stated in your letter.

To start the discussion, we would propose:

Vox makes a public announcement of its agressive and back-handed attack on GS. A public mea culpa.

Vox relinquishes rights to all lands in South Estonia. (ie south of Elipolis)

Vox gifts the City of Dissidentville to GS.

We look forward to hearing from you.

Regards ... Beta.

	06-06-2003 21:52									#180
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we are giving up territory here whihch I don't like

Jon Miller