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Old n Slow
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Vienna, VA
Jun 2002
time: 00:27
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Ah, to be silly once again. Looking among the stats we see that it is time to revolt, that we’re last in population (maybe due to occasional settler sacrifices?) and that we have a couple of wonders but otherwise cannot build any more. So in 1650 we tweak a couple of things & we revolt.
(1) 1660 -- and we’re despots. Build a couple of caravans -- the New Chuckles Settler returns to die on the altar to form a temple. Old Chuckles builds a dip. (Zulus start Sun Tsu’s Academy.)
(2) 1670 -- Move a few guys around.
(3) 1680 -- switch the palace building activity to Monty Python; Leiden switches the shields over to a caravan Some of the cities experience a great need to cry out for entertainment -- ok, ok, next turn Elvis appears simultaneously in many places.
(4) 1690 -- Population = 1M; and we revolt again.
(5) 1700 -- King Soupy sees the first camel deliver demanded Gems from Wabbit to New Chuckles for 39g. Hmmm, nice idea, less than stellar payoff. Silly Walks, Beeblebrox, Fright wig, & Wabbit all Xin.
(6) 1710 -- The four cities above unXin; We discover Banking. Have a choice of Engineering or Physics. Hmmmmmmm. We choose Engineering. Our dip from Old Chuckles finally finishes his walk of a crooked mile & the French want to talk with us. OK. They declare war -- no ifs, ands, or butts (silly attempt at Adam Sandler humor). Well, they’re bigger than we are, have more stuff, more techs, more everything. At least they are a big target. The dip moves in anyway & establishes an embassy (didn’t recall if anything was stolen from the French yet … but it should be. They have a LOT of techs that we could use.)
(7) 1720 -- Demanded Gold from Silly to Cher arrives for 186g. Hmmm -- this is more like it, the triremes make the five space gap from Pie Island to France with ease, so shipping should become a higher priority in the scheme of things. The two Barb Caravels in the NW finally split with one disappearing off to the west & the other sailing east -- just north of Monty Python. Four cities Xin again.
(8) 1730 -- And the Barbs sail right on by. Beeb unXins, & we revolt.
(9) 1740 -- Republic -- Silly remains on Xin, the other two recover. (France discovers Invention & begins Leo’s.)
(10) 1750 -- Hmm -- last turn -- haven’t violated any silly rules yet that I can recall -- so we opt to build a temple in Leidan without sacrificing a settler, thus violating Straybow’s rule (maybe we can store up six to eight camels & see if we can discover Mono during Straybow’s set of turns -- would he choose to violate his own rule that turn & perhaps build Mike’s with less blood?) Demanded silver from Bozo’s to Chartres = 200+
Notes & comments for next & future players: I didn’t time the production & delivery of camels as well as I could have (build during despotism, ship during monarchy, deliver as a republic) nor Xin optimally (we can probably squeeze out a few more settlers & then join them to create more size five sites.) Even though France declared war, there has been no action on either of our parts (although I did see a cruc north of the Chuckles early on in my set of turns. I didn’t attempt any tech stealing (was delivering freight instead) as I wanted the information more than a random tech -- we can use enough dips to build Marco’s for the information available.
We’ll also want camels for trade & a store of camels for the hopefully available wonders (when the techs happen) -- personally, I think that with our silly rules & few units to date, the Statue may be more important than Leo’s.
Rats -- I ended up playing ten turns -- when I noticed that this is the third round (and I originally set the requirement at eight turns each at this point.) I think that it would be unfair for me to require playing only eight when I snuck in a couple of extra turns -- each player can play eight or ten as the spirit moves.
Just to remind JRabbit & everyone else:
Old n Slow -- Trucks drive west (and when we finally get trucks I’ll post all of the sub ifs, ands, or butts that we’ll want to recall)
STYOM -- Research techs in order
atawa -- Must change government every four years (oedo year)
Straybow -- Sacrifice a builder (settler or engineer) with each happiness improvement (Temple, Col, Cath), and a builder per camel for each happiness wonder
rjmatsleepers -- Always have a palace under construction.
Jrabbit -- MUST ignore (and document) one of the other rules (for one turn) during the player set of turns.
La Fayette -- units with move=1 move vert/horizontally, units with move = 2 or 3 on the diagonal
BobSmurf42 -- Cycle through the governments when changing
atomant -- Build units with a defensive attitude until Leadership (no Horse, Cat, Char, Ele, Knight, and Cruc, (Cannons delayed))
 Attachment: so_a1750.sav
This has been downloaded 4 time(s).
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La Fayette
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albi, france
Oct 2000
time: 06:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Six Thousand Year Old Man
This looks like a tough one!
-Six |
Sure it is!
But good use of Magellan should be really helpful
(and I agree with OldnSlow: SoL would be very nice to grab)
Last edited by La Fayette on 26-06-2003 at 21:36
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Six Thousand Year Old Man
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Ad Rock
Aug 2000
time: 00:27
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STYOM regains the throne, but steps on a banana peel while ascending the steps. Someone's been conducting polls around here, he thinks.
It's 1750, and "The High  Council of the Americans is meeting in Silly Walks". Let's hear what they have to say:
Oooh, seas turning red with blood, we likeses that, don't we precious? 
The torch of knowledge sputters. 
Our Economic Advisor thinks we're rich  . What a maroon. April Cantor says "Dog!" to him. Kinky. 
April wants embassies, and
Elvis is content.
Temperature check: No need for the therapist - we really are inadequate. We're spotless, and the only foreigners we've met, are at war with us. 6th in population (1,040,000), 5th in Mfg goods, 3rd in GNP. We have 21 gold in the bank and have almost researched Engineering.
Goals... get some wonders. Leo's and Statue would both be a big help.
Next oedo years: 1756, 1764.
1750: Moves some units around. The French are researching Gunpowder, which should throw a real scare into our Pikemen... and we can't build offensive units 
French acquire Medicine. Spanish start Shakespeare.
1752: Engineering discovered; researching Invention, on the top of the list, and also on the path to Democracy 
Leiden builds a Temple (  I didn't notice that); we only have one Settler so I decide to ignore Straybow's rule.
Does Navigation end the Trireme drowning problem? Looking that up - NO it does not  Trireme's move 5 now, but they still have to be careful.
We send an emissary to the French and they vow to rid the world of us. Ahh, MGE.
Sioux begin work on Leonardo. Zulus are nearly finished Shakespeare.
1754: REVOLUTION.
Zulu's build Shakespeare. Spanish abandon.
1756: Despotism formed. Taxes adjusted to 6.2.2. Unhappiness everywhere
There is a French Knight outside of New Chuckles, taunting the defenders mercilessly.
Dye Goodie>Tours 84 g. Probably would have had a better bonus in Republic, but oh well...
* Six Thousand Year Old Man stops briefly to go out on the terrace with a fine cigar, and contemplate the world...
* Six Thousand Year Old Man returns, feeling nauseous after the cigar... no, wait, it's our position in this game that's to blame 
French revolt. Our Pikemen in New Chuckles resist the Knight attack and become vet.
French Crusaders near Old Chuckles.
1758: We ask to parley with the French and are rebuffed, as the first buffing didn't 'take'. Old Chuckles is in deep doo-doo. 
Defenders routed in Old Chuckles.
1760: French won't talk, Sioux vow to be rid of us forever.
1762: Gems Bozo>Chartres 52g, Gold Goodie>Chartres 62g, Hides Leiden>Chartres 70g. We buy up a couple of rows of Caravans with the proceeds. Annoyingly, next turn is an oedo year, so we have to revolt, thus producing no beakers... and we need exactly one beaker to obtain Invention.
REVOLUTION.
French move a large number of Catapults down the road, towards New Chuckles.
1764: Monarchy formed. Trading withheld, due to impending discovery of Invention.
French develop Gunpowder.
1766: We discover Invention; research Democracy as it is first alphabetically. 
Gunpowder stolen from Chartres. Musketeers rushed in New Chuckles.
(Stupidly forgot to incrementally rushbuy before attempting theft, but then, who knew we'd luck into Gunpowder?)
Wool Wabbit>Chartres, 74 g. I dare not disembark the Wool Caravan on dry land next to Paris, lest the French kill it. Annoyingly, most of their large cities seem to be inland, or halfway around the island.
1768: Some production shifted. Amazingly, we may be able to celebrate a couple of cities once we have Republic again, due to the trade routes.
With that, STYOM ducks out of office via the back door. Population is down to 1,020,000, but we have 3 more techs and should get Demo shortly.
Caravel at 57,55 is bound for Wounded Knee (Gold demander) - it should pay off nicely when we go back to Republic. I thoroughly recommend stealing more techs from the French. I have been intermittently been tickling caravan production, and we have lots of those ready to come online - others could be converted to Diplos; we have the cash.
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rjmatsleepers
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Whos turn is it? (Atawa?)
Did we decide to take a summer break?
RJM atSleepers
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La Fayette
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albi, france
Oct 2000
time: 06:27
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quote:
Originally posted by rjmatsleepers
Did we decide to take a summer break?
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It seems that many of us did that without being allowed: all succession games are going wery slowly
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rjmatsleepers
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No sign of Atawa and no response from Straybow in the last few days - shall I jump in?
If so, does anyone have any thoughts about the best strategy for winning this game? We seem to be stymied on conquest by the rules on what units we can build and how they move. But AC landing is made difficult by the revolving government types and lack of choice on research. And how can we get a good trade system going?
My suggestion is that we should we focus on AC landing and try to build up our research capacity.
RJM at Sleepers
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rjmatsleepers
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quote:
Originally posted by Old n Slow
Go ahead & jump ahead.
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OK - I'll play today and post the results same time tomorrow.
RJM at Sleepers
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rjmatsleepers
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We have discovered Democracy (which is a real pain in the thing of my neighbours that I must not covet) and leadership (which will allow a bit more aggression). We are well on our way to Mysticism which will help with unhappiness.
I wasted a few shields moving the palace construction around and I got in a panic and rushed a musketeer in Verdun - particularly silly since I disbanded the pikeman a few turns later anyway.
We have peace with the French (for a few turns) and we can have peace with the Sioux if we want it.
I have left a few problems for the next player to sort out. I'm sure there is a ship chain to Chartres in there somewhere, but I couldn't get it working. My advice is to use the rabbit's rule exemption to avoid democracy - I suspect even despotism might be better.
Good luck.
RJM at Sleepers
(edited for typos and to add name.)
Attachment: so_a1784.sav
This has been downloaded 2 time(s).
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La Fayette
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albi, france
Oct 2000
time: 06:27
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quote:
Originally posted by rjmatsleepers
Since we are going to rely on caravan deliveries for income, I reduce taxes to 10% and increase science to 70% (=101 beakers)
RJM at Sleepers |
I would do exactly the contrary:
If my science mostly comes from caravan deliveries, I would set taxes up to 70% in order to improve incremental rushbuilding of those caravans and deliver more.
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rjmatsleepers
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quote:
Originally posted by La Fayette
I would do exactly the contrary:
If my science mostly comes from caravan deliveries, I would set taxes up to 70% in order to improve incremental rushbuilding of those caravans and deliver more. |
In general, you may be right, but during my turns we got about 145 beakers per turn from basic research and only abot 500 beakers in total from caravan deliveries. It might have been better if I could have delivered demanded goods, but I thought the risk of putting a caravan on French soil was too great so I only delivered by sea - mainly to Chartres. Plus the fact that I didn't get the ship chain working meant that we didn't deliver very frequently.
Lots of room for the next player to improve our trading!
RJM at Sleepers
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rjmatsleepers
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BTW in changing the name of New Chuckles I meant no disrespect to the men who fought and died at Verdun. My uncle was killed at Loos and my grandfather was wounded in the 3rd Ypres so I know that in RL sending ill equiped troops against a well defended position is not a laughing matter.
RJM at Sleepers
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rjmatsleepers
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quote:
Originally posted by La Fayette
I would do exactly the contrary:
If my science mostly comes from caravan deliveries, I would set taxes up to 70% in order to improve incremental rushbuilding of those caravans and deliver more. |
When I replied before, I forgot that a significant number of our beakers came from Xining and that these would be available whatever the science setting. However, the main problem was a bottle neck in transporting caravans to France. Even with 0% tax, I could still pay for the white goods and rush caravans faster than I could deliver them. Tacking the caravels and triremes adds so much distance, that I think it would not be possible to deliver more than 1 caravan per turn on average (because the final delivery is by trireme that can only hold 2 caravans and needs a turn to get back in position). There was no problem building caravans at that rate.
If there is no delivery problem, the crucial factor is how big the delivery bonus is. If (on average) the bonus is larger than the cost of rushing the caravans then there is no need to use tax dollars for that purpose. It doesn't take a very high proportion of demanded deliveries to achieve this.
BUT if on average the delivery bonus does not cover rush costs (and there are no transport constraints), using tax dollars to build caravans will increase beakers.
(At least that's the way it looks to me - more experienced players may wish to comment.)
RJM at Sleepers
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La Fayette
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albi, france
Oct 2000
time: 06:27
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RJM
1) If there is a bottleneck, this means that a high priority should be given to building ships instead of caravans.
2) A simple way to calculate whether a caravan is worthwhile:
- consider that 1 gold = 1 beaker (since you can either get more gold or more beakers by moving the tax slider)
- consider that the 'One Time Bonus' on delivery is twice the gold you get (because if you get 40g, you know you also get 40 beakers)
- consider that this doesn't take into account the continuing trade route(s) created (you could do that by calculating the Net Present Value of the flow of gold you will receive during the following years, but I don't think it's worth the effort)
Example:
A caravan rushbuilt from scratch costs 50g for the first row, then 25g for each of the 4 following rows = 150g (or more, after Feudalism, Chivalry and Gunpowder).
If you know that this caravan brings at least 60 or 70g when delivered undemanded in a given city, you can rushbuild from scratch: it's worth it (IMO, because 70 + 70 + 10 = 150, and 10 is a low estimate for the value of the continuing trade route and other side benefits of the delivery).
Rushbuilding from scratch is an important decision to take because it provides twice as many caravans as rushbuilding from 'some' shields in the box.
I think that many players are too wary in that matter. Perhaps this will induce them to rushbuild caravans more aggressively.
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rjmatsleepers
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quote:
Originally posted by La Fayette
RJM
1) If there is a bottleneck, this means that a high priority should be given to building ships instead of caravans.
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You are right. If I had rushed a caravel at Monty Python during my first turn rather than a caravan I would have been able to make more deliveries and we would have discovered mysticism.
Mea Culpa
(And in replaying my turns to check this out I realised I could have got Goodie celebrating and thus grown it to size 5 and set it Xining. This would have put us well on the path to Astronomy.)
Mea Maxima Culpa
quote:
2) A simple way to calculate whether a caravan is worthwhile:
- consider that 1 gold = 1 beaker (since you can either get more gold or more beakers by moving the tax slider)
- consider that the 'One Time Bonus' on delivery is twice the gold you get (because if you get 40g, you know you also get 40 beakers)
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This may be a useful calculation device, but when you come to rush the next caravan (or bribe the next barbarian), you can't use virtual gold from the beakers or future gold from your trade routes - only real gold will do. And if you have to increase the tax rate in order to rush the caravan, then the "value" of the beakers from delivery has to be offset against the "lost" beakers from the reduced science rate. If there is an SSC, this is likely to be the dominant effect.
RJM at Sleepers
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26-06-2003 19:51
The truth is even more terrifying: the gremlins have been at work here as well as on Settler II. My fancy-schmancy CD player is on the friz due to untraceable problems, and the terminal housing on one of my awe-inspiring speakers broke apart.
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