13-04-2003 08:01									#151
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I predicted as did many others that the victory would only be the beginning. The real test is now, after the war. I am just amazed though at how soon people divert a topic about happy people who are celebrating freedom for the firs time in 30 years into the evils of war. Yes, it is evil and yes the people need help now, but give them a break. It has only been three days.

	13-04-2003 08:05									#152
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quote: So, neither side is moving, but at the minimum, the French at all levels talk about healing ties.

Well of course they are. They realize that they completely miscalculated and have poisoned relations with the world's only superpower. All the brown-nosing in the world won't change what has happened, however, and you can be sure that American policy makers will remember France's duplicity.

quote: the insanity coming from the House.

They are insane, aren't they? I think we can agree on that...

	13-04-2003 08:08									#153
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quote: Originally posted by Lincoln I predicted as did many others that the victory would only be the beginning. The real test is now, after the war. I am just amazed though at how soon people divert a topic about happy people who are celebrating freedom for the firs time in 30 years into the evils of war. Yes, it is evil and yes the people need help now, but give them a break. It has only been three days.

The US could, and should have seen this sort of behavior happening, The same thing happened in Panama, last time the US went out "regime shopping". You can;t remove the only source of order and expect there not to be chaos, and since we are now responsible for Iraq, we are also responsible for law and order.

quote: sure that American policy makers will remember France's duplicity

Only if this admin. stays in power...

	13-04-2003 08:12									#154
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quote: Only if this admin. stays in power...

Neocons aren't the only ones pissed off about what the French have done. I'm about as moderate as they come and I'm still angry about what happened to Powell. I don't think a Democratic president is going to trust the French anymore than I do (unless Pelosi makes it to the White House ).

	13-04-2003 08:13									#155
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I wonder if more people would be happy now if we had bombed Baghdad like we did Dresden? Maybe if the people were walking around like zombies looking for a handout they would be happy because there was order?

	13-04-2003 08:17									#156
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Well folks, I am off to bed. Hugs and kisses to everyone...

	13-04-2003 08:19									#157
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quote: Originally posted by Ned I have just finished reading the posts on page two of this thread. The posts from Michael the Great and Sava, among others, notes the anarchy in Iraq today and calls for law and order. What I find puzzling about this is that I thought that the left was largely against the police, law and order and were favor anarchy. Was I wrong?

Not all lefties are anarchists. Don't lump the Libetarians in, either.

quote: Originally posted by Ned As to be people of Baghdad looting the German and hopefully the Russian and French embassies, is quite clear that the people of Baghdad are attacking Saddam's régime and their allies. The know the Germans, Russians and French were Saddam's allies.

Ah, because these embassies aren't guarded by US forces, like the US and UK embassies?

	13-04-2003 08:20									#158
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quote: Originally posted by Lincoln I do have a clue. The left is angry because the war went so well and the people celebrated their deliverance from Saddam by George Bush.

Clearly, your second statement contradicts your first.

	13-04-2003 08:32									#159
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"Let's dance"-Shi

This thread has drawn liberals like the family picnic drws flies.

Pictures of injured children, looters, etc...sure, there was a price to pay and children and shop owners have paid it in part, as have several of our troops.

Yet the children won't be going to Saddam's torture chambers. They won't be going to his sons torture chambers, or their sons torture chambers. One of the sons of Saddam saw a pretty girl, had her taken up and he raped her. Then he killed he and had her fed to his dogs.

That's enough of that ****. Those kids won't have to grow up to that. There was this one final price to pay to be FREE. When the price was paid, they danced in the streets along with the adults.

The shop owners who now pay a price will learn the benefits of freedom, the benficial atmosphere of free trade among a free, wealthy population.

Remember the eastern europeans who flipped off the stuffy French ****** and supported the war, why? Freedom. What's freedom? The ability to live in dignity, without fear of nazis, or commies, or republican guard taking you away in the night to suffer out your days being skinned or burned or shocked with electricity. To choose for yourself your dreams and to be able to follow them according to your abilities.

THAT is what our brave soldiers have brought to the people of Iraq. THAT is why they yell "thank you Mr Bush". That is why they...

DANCE IN THE STREETS!






With such joy.

Liberals, they eat a nice big juicy red apple, and when they are finished all they can do is ***** about the pits.

**** em.

	13-04-2003 08:54									#160
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quote: Originally posted by Drake Tungsten quote: Only if this admin. stays in power... Neocons aren't the only ones pissed off about what the French have done. I'm about as moderate as they come and I'm still angry about what happened to Powell. I don't think a Democratic president is going to trust the French anymore than I do (unless Pelosi makes it to the White House ).

Trsut can be repaired. besides, once Chirac is out as well, things can move forward.

	13-04-2003 09:16									#161
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I just spent an interesting couple of hours trying to find out what's going on in Baghdad and other places in Iraq. I saw only two reports on looting. One report said that the National Museum had been looted. Even the most cynical among us would say that this is a tragedy. The report also showed a youngster pushing a cart with toilet paper on it with a voiceover declaring that the kid had looted the toilet paper from a local hotel. This crime, of course, ranks right up there with the looting of the National Museum.

The other stories I saw concerned employment of the Iraqi police force in Baghdad to begin policing the streets. But this report I saw on CNN shocked me. The reporter made a statement which I found totally incredible. He said that the Iraqi police were trying to find a way of cooperating with the Americans without appearing to be "collaborators."

At this point the report ended. There was no explanation by the reporter as to what he meant by his statement "appearing to be collaborators." But clearly the reporter was of the trying to leave the impression that the people of Baghdad viewed the Americans as hostile occupiers to be resisted. Nothing we have seen heretofore in the cheering crowds greeting Americans would indicate that the people of Baghdad viewed the Americans in anything other than a favorable light. But we have this simple statement by CNN reporter, unexplained, with no background, that appears to cast a dark light on American presence in Baghdad. This is a CNN reporter. A CNN reporter!

Outrageous!

I am no longer going to watch CNN spew this anti-American drivel. I can understand this from Al Jazeera. I cannot understand this from an American network.

Last edited by Ned on 13-04-2003 at 10:32

	13-04-2003 09:19									#162
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Come on Ned, CNN is about as much unabashed American propaganda as nearly everything else.

	13-04-2003 09:55									#163
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The looting and vandalism of the National Museum is a god-awful tragedy. It breaks my heart. Who cares about the replaceable stuff? But this was priceless.

Last edited by DanS on 13-04-2003 at 10:01

	13-04-2003 10:08									#164
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quote: The looting and vandalism of the National Museum is a god-awful tragedy. It breaks my heart.

Agreed. Hopefully the British already stole all the good stuff and are keeping it safe in the British Museum.

I'm only half kidding on that one...

	13-04-2003 10:35									#165
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Oof.

	13-04-2003 11:00									#166
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quote: Originally posted by monkspider Come on Ned, CNN is about as much unabashed American propaganda as nearly everything else.

Bull. That was not the only anti-American report I saw tonight. It seems like the network had fallen off the fence onto its left side. We couple this with the recent revelations that CNN buckles to Arab pressure to slant stories in a certain way in order to gain access, and we begin to see a craven network whose reports cannot be trusted.

Fortunately, we still have MSNBC and FOX.

	13-04-2003 11:03									#167
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Outrageous! You mean there are people out there who aren't as ecstatic as those few hundred cheering people. Ned, you've just shown indignation because a report told you something that didn't jibe with your image of the world. For christsakes there was nothing anti-american about it except that it reported the anti-american feelings in Iraq. Big surprise. BTW I haven't seen many pictures of dancing Iraqis recently.

	13-04-2003 11:17									#168
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gsmoove, CNN is a private network. It can lie as much as it wants, but it cannot stay in business if it offends its base, the US public.

However, it has admitted that it has lied to us for 12 years about Saddam. Now it begins to adopt the editorial point of view of the Arab street in its reports. What are we to think about that?

It is lying to us again.

	13-04-2003 11:26									#169
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Ned, if you could possibly find anything to prove this besides the fact that a couple of days ago you saw a bunch of Arabs sticking their thumbs up at American troops I would be astonished. Besides, CNNs job should not be to keep the public content but to inform them.

	13-04-2003 12:26									#170
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DP

DP

Last edited by Lancer on 13-04-2003 at 14:18

	13-04-2003 14:16									#171
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CNN is looking to hire Baghdad Bob because they admire his fair editorialising.

	13-04-2003 14:30									#172
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quote: I am amazed you people, who I deem intelligent, insist on denying the evidence that Baghdad has entered anarchy, where common thugs and needy people use their force to pillage what they want/can. You seem to believe they are driven by political conciousness, but they are not. They are driven by greed or need, and the general climate of "everthing is allowed".

i would have said the same thing, but i thought it was obvious to any logical being

	13-04-2003 14:33									#173
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Obviously...your point? It's already progress, the thugs aren't in government.

	13-04-2003 14:57									#174
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quote: Yet the children won't be going to Saddam's torture chambers. They won't be going to his sons torture chambers, or their sons torture chambers. One of the sons of Saddam saw a pretty girl, had her taken up and he raped her. Then he killed he and had her fed to his dogs. That's enough of that ****. Those kids won't have to grow up to that. There was this one final price to pay to be FREE. When the price was paid, they danced in the streets along with the adults. The shop owners who now pay a price will learn the benefits of freedom, the benficial atmosphere of free trade among a free, wealthy population.

ah so you're in the liberating business now! could you please free the (for 30 years) occupied northern cyprus? (our friends across the aegean) the turks are waiting for you

	13-04-2003 15:08									#175
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I'm all for it Markos, but sadly it's been determined the UN wouldn't let us.

Maybe you could ask the French for help?

Actually I'm all for it, though I'm generally considered nuts for being so.

Besides, Syria, Iran, NK and Canada are ahead of Cyprus on the list...

How are things for the Greeks on Cyprus? Why hasn't Greece invaded?

	13-04-2003 15:09									#176
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quote: occupied northern cyprus?

not occupied, Liberated from greek oppression and fear of genocide.

	13-04-2003 15:13									#177
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AzAzel, you can say what you want. Markos assures me he is not really a moderator.

	13-04-2003 15:17									#178
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all I am saying is that he can keep his vile propoganda to his "satire" site, no need to destroy these forums, and all of DanQ's hard work with this foul crap.

	13-04-2003 15:25									#179
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If I was president Bush I'd set up a Kurdish state. When the Turks came down all pissed off I'd throw them out of Iraq with a lesson in who not to **** with. Then I'd take Cyprus along with the Greeks and evict the Turks, giving it to Greece. Then, once the US forces in europe got down there, I'd throw the Turks out of Constantinople, and europe. I'd then set up Byzantium again.

But that's just me.

	13-04-2003 15:26									#180
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Oh yeah, I'd also kick them outa Turkish Kurdistan.