13-07-2003 10:09									#91
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Odin

I like your divisions . Though I see not too much different in the political systems of the US and Canada to put them in different places.

You are totally correct that Fascism is a subset of Absolutism, and does not mean dictatorship in general.

	13-07-2003 10:16									#92
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Actually you are wrong. In every Fascist state the government was for the MAJORITY.

They said they were, but you have to know that's crap. Anyway democracy is about protecting the rights of the minorities.

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui quote: Those are specific govts that can only exist once. I'm asking you for a term that describes people who believe in authoritarian, capitalist regimes. We need a name to put them on the spectrum. You already have a name. Authoritarian Capitalism. That sounds ok to me.

No one calls fascists authoritarian capitalists. They call them fascists. Hence the meaning of the word. The meaning of words are determined by the way people use them. True, it's lazy, but that's the way language works. No one wants to use the term authoritarian capitalist, and they shouldn't have to.

	13-07-2003 10:21									#93
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

a liberal philosophy teacher this past year often told me straight up to shut up and say nothing else in the class because of things like he would say that there is now a war on arabs in america and i raised my hand and said basically, there's no war on a group of people... what the hell?

and students soak up this liberal bullshit?

	13-07-2003 10:23									#94
	Suffering from ads?

quote: They said they were, but you have to know that's crap.

Why is that crap? It's 100% the truth. When Mussolini was going for the 'Italians' you think that was the minority... in Italy?!

quote: No one calls fascists authoritarian capitalists. They call them fascists. Hence the meaning of the word.

Jeez, you are the king of circular logic.

No one calls Communists dictators. They call them Communists. Hence the meaning of the word. How's that?

And secondly, they really AREN'T capitalist. They use some capitalism, but they are as capitalist as Sweden is today. If you want to call them Authoritarian Corporatist, that would be much more acceptable.

quote: The meaning of words are determined by the way people use them. True, it's lazy, but that's the way language works. No one wants to use the term authoritarian capitalist, and they shouldn't have to.

You mean because some moron calls Ashcroft a Fascist, I'm supposed to accept it?

Sorry, but I'm not going to accept the dumbing down of vocabulary to suit the idiot masses who are too lazy to ****ing look something up and call things what they really God damn mean!

And STILL no one has called Musharraf a Fascist! No one has called Joseph Kabila a Fascist! UNDER YOUR DEFINTION, they must be called that!

	13-07-2003 10:26									#95
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer a liberal philosophy teacher this past year often told me straight up to shut up and say nothing else in the class because of things like he would say that there is now a war on arabs in america and i raised my hand and said basically, there's no war on a group of people... what the hell? and students soak up this liberal bullshit?

Honestly, I would tell you to be quite too. The teacher does have to keep order and can't just let people mouth off and disrupt the class.

	13-07-2003 10:28									#96
	Tired of ads?

quote: Republic: Rule of the people through elected "Wise.Elite" -US -Republican Rome -Modern Russia -Modern Egypt -Modern Turkey -Mexico Democracy: Rule of elected common people. -Most European counties -Canada -Modern Japan -Australia -Modern South Africa -Modern Israel -Ancient Athens

what the hell? you're definitions are bullshit... a Republic is representative gov't made up of a Congress (as opposed to a parliament) whose members are elected individually instead of as a party. they also tend to be federal. 'Democracies' technically are countries where the citizens always vote be plebiciete (Which you seem to have gotten right with ancient Athens but last time i checked, "most European countries" as you called them, didn't have the whole citizenry voting over every issue)...

	13-07-2003 10:29									#97
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Honestly, I would tell you to be quite too.

I knew Kid was against Freedom of Speech. Lefties can disrupt class all they want... but not a Righty... oh no!

	13-07-2003 10:29									#98
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

quote: Honestly, I would tell you to be quite too. The teacher does have to keep order and can't just let people mouth off and disrupt the class.

i raised my hand and only spoke when i was called on...

	13-07-2003 10:32									#99
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui No one calls Communists dictators. They call them Communists. Hence the meaning of the word. How's that?

Fine, but communists are not authoritarian by definition. The fact that you call communists who believe in authoritarian govt communists but you won't call capitalists who believe in authoritarian govt fascists shows your prejudice.

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui And secondly, they really AREN'T capitalist. They use some capitalism, but they are as capitalist as Sweden is today. If you want to call them Authoritarian Corporatist, that would be much more acceptable.

They are capitalist because they believe in the private ownership or the means of production. It's got nothing to do with free markets.

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui quote: The meaning of words are determined by the way people use them. True, it's lazy, but that's the way language works. No one wants to use the term authoritarian capitalist, and they shouldn't have to. You mean because some moron calls Ashcroft a Fascist, I'm supposed to accept it? Sorry, but I'm not going to accept the dumbing down of vocabulary to suit the idiot masses who are too lazy to ****ing look something up and call things what they really God damn mean! And STILL no one has called Musharraf a Fascist! No one has called Joseph Kabila a Fascist! UNDER YOUR DEFINTION, they must be called that!

If people use the word that way then it is you who are wrong. You can argue on the wrong side all you want, but it doesn't change things.

	13-07-2003 10:34									#100
	Increase the size of your Attachments

i'm not concerned about free speech in the classroom... i honestly dont think students should have the right to say whatever they want to... when the teacher however is horribly biased there is a need for an equalification...

	13-07-2003 10:34									#101
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer i raised my hand and only spoke when i was called on...

I'm sorry if that true, but in most cases it's not. I know there are shitty teachers though. You didn't tell him that we should slaughter all the homosexuals did you?

	13-07-2003 10:38									#102
	Suffering from ads?

quote: The fact that you call communists who believe in authoritarian govt communists but you won't call capitalists who believe in authoritarian govt fascists shows your prejudice.

Didn't I just say like a page back that Stalin isn't a Communist? Didn't I?

You just don't want to read correctly, admit it.

Also Authoritarian Capitalists aren't Fascists. They are Authoritarian Capitalists... just like Democratic Capitalists are simply Democratic Capitalists.

Btw, your sentance is poor logic. It should read (to be consistant):

The fact that you call communists who believe in authoritarian govt communists but you won't call capitalists who believe in authoritarian govt capitalists shows your prejudice.

You can't say A=A : B=C. The correct response is A=A : B=B.

quote: They are capitalist because they believe in the private ownership or the means of production. It's got nothing to do with free markets.

If there are substantial restrictions on free markets it is a mixed economy, not capitalism.

quote: If people use the word that way then it is you who are wrong.

Wooooo... I guess Communists are dictatorship backers... since people use the word to describe the Soviet Union and China. Since people use the word that way, I guess you are wrong in saying Communism is something else!

Should I pull up the dictionary defintion of Fascism again? It backs me, you know?

People that use the word the wrong way are STILL WRONG.

Btw, you NEVER ANSWERED ME! And STILL no one has called Musharraf a Fascist! No one has called Joseph Kabila a Fascist! UNDER YOUR DEFINTION, they must be called that!

Thank you for ignoring questions that destroy your point.

	13-07-2003 10:41									#103
	Support Apolyton

Kidicious:

alright let me re-state that particular example... he was rambling about god knows what... how evil bush is i guess... (what this got to do with learning i dont know) and then said something like, "now with the war on arabs in america...." (and he was going to continue on as if that 'war on arabs' was something assumed that everybody knew)... so my hand shot up and i was like, "There's no war on arabs... am i being hunted down? stop spreading your liberal nonsense to this class." and he said his last words saying that there was one and i just didnt know and then told me that the discussion was over.

****'s happened dozens of times with various topics. i never said **** crazy...

	13-07-2003 10:44									#104
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer Kidicious: alright let me re-state that particular example... he was rambling about god knows what... how evil bush is i guess... (what this got to do with learning i dont know) and then said something like, "now with the war on arabs in america...." (and he was going to continue on as if that 'war on arabs' was something assumed that everybody knew)... so my hand shot up and i was like, "There's no war on arabs... am i being hunted down? stop spreading your liberal nonsense to this class." and he said his last words saying that there was one and i just didnt know and then told me that the discussion was over. ****'s happened dozens of times with various topics. i never said **** crazy...

This is high school I presume? You should have tried to get out of that class. He had no business treating you that way, and using his classroom to try and indoctrinate you to his ideology. That's too bad. He probably has tenure too, and the school has to jsut wait until he retires. I don't think they can fire him for that.

	13-07-2003 10:54									#105
	Support Apolyton

Kid:

why would they fire him? the administration most definently agrees with his politics...

	13-07-2003 10:56									#106
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui quote: The fact that you call communists who believe in authoritarian govt communists but you won't call capitalists who believe in authoritarian govt fascists shows your prejudice. Didn't I just say like a page back that Stalin isn't a Communist? Didn't I?

He claimed at least to believe that the means of production should be owned by the community, so why wasn't he a communist?

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Also Authoritarian Capitalists aren't Fascists. They are Authoritarian Capitalists... just like Democratic Capitalists are simply Democratic Capitalists.

I just made that damn term up. It's not real, because I don't even plan on using it. You can use it, but everyone is going to think you are talking about fascists.

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Btw, your sentance is poor logic. It should read (to be consistant): The fact that you call communists who believe in authoritarian govt communists but you won't call capitalists who believe in authoritarian govt capitalists shows your prejudice. You can't say A=A : B=C. The correct response is A=A : B=B.

Yeah, ok

quote: They are capitalist because they believe in the private ownership or the means of production. It's got nothing to do with free markets.

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui If there are substantial restrictions on free markets it is a mixed economy, not capitalism.

I always hated that term mixed economy. If you want to use that term then don't use the term capitalism, because there are no capitalist systems that aren't 'mixed.' You know damn well that capitalism means the private ownership of the means of production.

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui quote: If people use the word that way then it is you who are wrong. Should I pull up the dictionary defintion of Fascism again? It backs me, you know?

I saw the definition, and I disagree. It's up for interpretation. You yourself defined it relative to the meaning that you desire. Remember? The dictionary says the fascism is racist and you said it didn't have to be.

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Btw, you NEVER ANSWERED ME! And STILL no one has called Musharraf a Fascist! No one has called Joseph Kabila a Fascist! UNDER YOUR DEFINTION, they must be called that! Thank you for ignoring questions that destroy your point.

no comment

	13-07-2003 11:01									#107
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer Kid: why would they fire him? the administration most definently agrees with his politics...

I don't see why you think that unless you know them. Believe it or not principals don't like that ****. If you went and complained they would probably reprimand him. That is, if they were worth a ****. There are ways they can punish him too. They can make it so that he can only teach remedial math or something.

	13-07-2003 11:04									#108
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

kid:

quote: They can make it so that he can only teach remedial math or something.

interestingly enough there was two self-declared republican teachers and one of them (an older man) taught just that...

	13-07-2003 11:10									#109
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Ok Imran. I call them fascists. So how is that suppose to destroy my point.

	13-07-2003 11:57									#110
	Re: Things which piss me off.... Teachers sprouting ignorance! Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Vesayen Remember the maine!" Children, we went to war with spain because they blew up our ship the maine, in their harbor! When we confronted them they were quite shocked and claimed they didnt do it! Afterall, why would they want to blow up a civilian ship for the hell of it in a very crowded commercial harbor, which killed several dozen people on the docks and downed 3 of our their own commercial ships! Those dastardly Spanish-it was all part of the trick!

civilian ship?

	13-07-2003 11:59									#111
	Increase Your PM Length

You people are weird!

And all the political theory flying around? rank amateurism!

	13-07-2003 12:09									#112
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

I'm just half serious and bored. I do consider myself an amateur though. Politics isn't my strength.

	13-07-2003 21:29									#113
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by Boris Godunov It's not that funny, though, since Creationists are actually getting some dumb**** county boards to allow teaching their crap in science classes, as if there was something remotely scientific about it.

What, you mean cretinists?

	13-07-2003 21:43									#114
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

My history teacher taught that the Maine was the reason, but that it was later found to be bunk.

	13-07-2003 22:08									#115
	Got spare money?

quote: Ok Imran. I call them fascists. So how is that suppose to destroy my point.

Because you've just shown yourself to be a Grade A moron, who shouldn't use the word Fascist because you have no idea what it means.

Btw, I've never met a single person who thought Authoritarian Capitalist = Fascism... well except you.

	13-07-2003 22:12									#116
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Btw, I've never met a single person who thought Authoritarian Capitalist = Fascism... well except you.

You ass. I just made up the term Authoritarian Capitalism last night on this very thread. Stop pretending it's a real word. Look who's calling who a moron.

	13-07-2003 22:12									#117
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Haven't you learned Imran? If the left hates you, you are a facist pig, if the right hates you, you are a commie rat.

	13-07-2003 22:14									#118
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Stop pretending it's a real word.

IT IS A REAL WORD, YOU UTTER WASTE OF SPACE!

How about the book, "Singapore's Authoritarian Capitalism". You still think you made up the term now?

http://www.thelockeinstitute.org/books/singapore.html

quote: Haven't you learned Imran? If the left hates you, you are a facist pig, if the right hates you, you are a commie rat.

True dat.

	13-07-2003 22:17									#119
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui quote: Stop pretending it's a real word. IT IS A REAL WORD, YOU UTTER WASTE OF SPACE!

If it were you were completely unaware of it last night. Now you know all about it, huh? Your pitifull.

	13-07-2003 22:17									#120
	Inflate your Upload Space

Personal attacks! Yay!
* VJ grabs popcorn *