12-03-2004 05:13									#151
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This is no way Al Qaeda. I mean they already identified the bombs normally used by ETA. ETA and Al Qaeda working together? I cringe at the thought.

	12-03-2004 05:16									#152
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quote: Originally posted by Chilean President The SER Radio from Spain is talking about a kamikaze (suiced bombers). I think Al Qaeda is the responsible for this attack... but perhaps they did it with the help of ETA.

Oh great! In the 1970s it was the alliance of the Bader-Meyrhoff, Brigate Rose, Japanese Red Army Faction, and the PLO funded and co-ordinated by the KGB. Now it's the al-Qaeda, ETA axis. Who else will join, and which nation will underwrite them in the hopes of destabilizing the world?

	12-03-2004 05:18									#153
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quote: Originally posted by Giancarlo This is no way Al Qaeda. I mean they already identified the bombs normally used by ETA. ETA and Al Qaeda working together? I cringe at the thought.

That is a lie!

The explosives are not those that ETA uses!

	12-03-2004 05:19									#155
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I also find repulsive the thought of ETA and Al Qaeda working together. I mean are Eta THAT hostile? Don't they see the human beings that live next door to them? Do they disregard human life and do they hate the Spanish so much as to do that? For independence or whatever? I find that very hard to believe although I admit I don't know much about the Eta.

Such cold blodded massive killings though I think have to come from somewhere away. Somewhere where they don't care and can't relate at all with the people of Spain. Nothing is certain, waiting for the reports of the spanish police is the best one can do at the moment but I think there are some chances this could be Al Qaeda or some fridge group of Eta? But such hatred...


Also our_man said maybe they did it, didn't know how many lives would get lost and now they don't like it so they don't claim it.. I doubt this... I think one who plants 10 bombs on hours where the trains will be packed with people knows very well what he's doing...

	12-03-2004 05:19									#156
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quote: Originally posted by Ned I don't think al Qaeda has always used suicide bombers. That just was just a byproduct of using airplanes as weapons. The WTC bombing in '93 was not a suicide bombing. Ditto the embassy bombings in '98. All this shows is that American security seems to have diverted new attacks to Europe.

or they haven't tried to hit America yet

	12-03-2004 05:21									#157
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The message that Al Qaeda send to the Arab British newspaper (if it's true) have also a threat to the US:

"We have great news for the muslims around the world. The attack 'Winds of Black Death' is almost ready to be released over the US. It's 90% done and, with God's will, very near".

Again, I don't know if that letter (or e-mail) is real or not, but that's what some international medias are saying at this point.

	12-03-2004 05:22									#158
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quote: Originally posted by Alfonso That is a lie! The explosives are not those that ETA uses!

So the interior ministry is lying?

"The Interior Ministry said tests showed the explosives used in the attacks were a kind of dynamite normally used by ETA. "

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...pain_bombings_5

	12-03-2004 05:23									#159
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quote: Originally posted by Giancarlo This is no way Al Qaeda. I mean they already identified the bombs normally used by ETA. ETA and Al Qaeda working together? I cringe at the thought.

That's no true. The explosive (Tytadine) is frecuently use by ETA but the bomb made with this explosiveius no usual for ETA.

	12-03-2004 05:24									#160
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it is not rare that the ministry lies in Spain

	12-03-2004 05:24									#161
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quote: Originally posted by WRW That's no true. The explosive (Tytadine) is frecuently use by ETA but the bomb made with this explosiveius no usual for ETA.

Okay this I did not hear... I think it may have been a possibility that ETA either acquired new materials they never used before, or worked with Al Qaeda.

	12-03-2004 05:26									#162
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quote: Originally posted by Chilean President "We have great news for the muslims around the world. The attack 'Winds of Black Death' is almost ready to be released over the US. It's 90% done and, with God's will, very near".

Define terrorism.

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	12-03-2004 05:26									#163
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the used explosive is of Spanish manufacture, eta does not use Spanish explosives.

	12-03-2004 05:28									#164
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quote: Originally posted by Alfonso the used explosive is of Spanish manufacture, eta does not use Spanish explosives.

I thought it was French? Well that is what I heard. Maybe not... I am reading up more on it but I would rather wait for a full police investigation.

	12-03-2004 05:33									#165
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[QUOTE] Originally posted by paiktis22
I also find repulsive the thought of ETA and Al Qaeda working together. I mean are Eta THAT hostile? Don't they see the human beings that live next door to them? Do they disregard human life and do they hate the Spanish so much as to do that? For independence or whatever? I find that very hard to believe although I admit I don't know much about the Eta. [QUOTE]
Welcome to the real world. You have discovered the respect that ETA has for the life of people who don´t think like them. They have killed thousand of times before (or maybe it was also Al-Qaeda who did in their name?) I fail to see why you respect more the life if you kill just one person instead of 100 people.

This situation has to stop. Many foreign people still see ETA as some kind of heroes. They are nothing but assassins. They kidnapped a man (Miguel Angel Blanco) and asked the government for an impossible thing or they would kill him. Then they blamed the government for the death of that man. They have killed with cold blood and no feelings lots of people. Why the hell they are heroes? No! They are not heroes. They are assassins who menace good willing people who just want to live and let live. Like all the terrorists are. Even when terrorists pursue good will goals, (which is not the case) they are nothing else than assassins.

	12-03-2004 05:37									#166
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quote: Originally posted by Alfonso the used explosive is of Spanish manufacture, eta does not use Spanish explosives.

Of course, they use Basque ones

This debate is esterile. The mere fact that we are discussing it probes that for some people there is one big difference between an Al-Qaeda attack and an ETA attack. They want to blame Aznar for it, which would not be true even if Al-Qaeda was involved in some degree.

	12-03-2004 05:38									#167
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If this is Al Qaeda's work, I fear Madrid may see more bombs in the days to come, perhaps already tomorrow. The method of operation would seem to resemble that of the synagogue bombings in Istanbul in November, and those were followed by more bombings less than a week later.

I sure hope the Spanish authorities are aware of this and taking their precautions as best they can.

	12-03-2004 05:39									#168
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BTW I can't help but thinking... Turkey next door, now Spain... and at summer the Athens Olympics... Maybe I'm carried away but I do have a gut feeling that was Al Qaeda or something relevant to it. And they did it as "payback" for Spain government's support of the US/UK invasion to Iraq.

I find two things disquietning (to say the least)

_There was no warning. There was no red flags raised, nothing. Either by the US or the Interpol or the Europol or the Spanish agencies. It was a "shot" from nowhere.
Am I mistaken in this? I don't know I'm asking.

_Whoever did this, if it wasn't Eta, has no qualms of hitting Europe. True, it may "favor" those who supported the US but it is actually IMHO trying to split Europe the way the US has tried.

	12-03-2004 05:39									#169
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The Spanish authorities have more preventive measures than many other countries in place for this. We been dealing with bombings for decades.

	12-03-2004 05:40									#170
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quote: Originally posted by Alfonso it is not rare that the ministry lies in Spain

It is not rare that some people say that everithing the ministry says in Spain are lies. I wonder what they would say if the minister stated that the Sun was shining.

	12-03-2004 05:41									#171
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Oliver, I don't know virtually anything about the Eta or the IRA so I don't know how many they've killed or why.
I just find it unbelievable for people they live next door to other people (the same country) to attack and kill so many. It just doesn't click, but as I said I know next to nothing about them. They never killed so many people in one shot though from what I read. ABout people capable of doing something like this, oh yes, it is the real world allright.

	12-03-2004 05:42									#172
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quote: Originally posted by OliverFA Welcome to the real world. You have discovered the respect that ETA has for the life of people who don´t think like them. They have killed thousand of times before (or maybe it was also Al-Qaeda who did in their name?) I fail to see why you respect more the life if you kill just one person instead of 100 people. This situation has to stop. Many foreign people still see ETA as some kind of heroes. They are nothing but assassins. They kidnapped a man (Miguel Angel Blanco) and asked the government for an impossible thing or they would kill him. Then they blamed the government for the death of that man. They have killed with cold blood and no feelings lots of people. Why the hell they are heroes? No! They are not heroes. They are assassins who menace good willing people who just want to live and let live. Like all the terrorists are. Even when terrorists pursue good will goals, (which is not the case) they are nothing else than assassins.

A very good explanation.

	12-03-2004 05:43									#173
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Freedom Fighters or Terrorists?

	12-03-2004 05:43									#174
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quote: Originally posted by Niessuh Please, don't mix the position of Spain at the Iraq conflict with this. I can assure you that the majority of spanish are against that war. If they continue supporting our government is because the (supposed) good economic growth and prosperity

I didn't... I'm on the right side of the spectrum wrt the WoT. I was just pointing out that they need to focus on their interior terrorist problems.

	12-03-2004 05:44									#175
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ETA = Terrorists. Freedom fighters? Really? How so? By blowing up trains with a bunch of innocent civilians on them?

Don't even dare label them any differently.

	12-03-2004 05:44									#176
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quote: Originally posted by Giancarlo The Spanish authorities have more preventive measures than many other countries in place for this. We been dealing with bombings for decades.

I'm aware of that, I merely pointed out that it is not a given thing that they are seriously reckoning with additional attacks in the days to come. Which they should be prepared for.

	12-03-2004 05:45									#177
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quote: Originally posted by Giancarlo The Spanish authorities have more preventive measures than many other countries in place for this. We been dealing with bombings for decades.

Plus they were fearing something terrible for this election (in fact ETA has tried to act in every election, like when they almost killed Aznar when he was still not president). Police was ready, but it´s impossible to control everything.

	12-03-2004 05:50									#178
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quote: Originally posted by OliverFA Plus they were fearing something terrible for this election (in fact ETA has tried to act in every election, like when they almost killed Aznar when he was still not president). Police was ready, but it´s impossible to control everything.

Yeah you can't have cops in every place at every time... the police however have rapid reaction and did manage to prevent some explosions.

	12-03-2004 05:51									#179
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Speaking about Eta, how can they justify killing of inoccents when they are under no occupation, they live in on eof the richest parts of Spain etc? Were there wars or animocity between Basques and other Spanish?
I'm asking that because you said many people see them as heroes...

	12-03-2004 05:51									#180
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quote: Originally posted by paiktis22 BTW I can't help but thinking... Turkey next door, now Spain... and at summer the Athens Olympics...

****, that's true... I hope they have REALLY tight security at the Olympic Games this summer