12-07-2004 05:50									#211
	Put an end to popups!

1. I heard somewhere that you can't capture a MW unless you have a full movement point left. I don't know if it's true.
2. I wonder if we'll have any "credit" accumulated with the former when we move it back to the same square and continue terriforming the same thing.

	12-07-2004 06:02									#212
	Full PM-box? Change here!

1. Not sure about this, but even if we fail to capture, given the hefty penalties mind worms get before 2115, we should definitely win with 2/3 of a movement point, and probably win with 1/3 of a movement point (need to test this, though).

2. Not sure, but we might as well move back to the original tile (which was it?) since if it was a good choice before, it's a good choice now.

	12-07-2004 06:54									#213
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

We will capture and move onto a MW with 1/3 movement on the river, or on a road.

We will capture and possibly move onto a MW with 1/3 movement elsewhere. Other 'chances' of moving don't effect a capture, even if you can't get into the square.

All this is important for our very first MW, for which there is no risk of not capturing. Thus, I agree that moving the IndScout first is best. The spore launcher can wait till end of turn.

Former path was as indicated in a picture here....here

Former will not have moves saved (doesn't save between turns AFAIK)

	13-07-2004 04:18									#214
	Remove this text

I hand the playing baton back to the Chairman of the Council of Lords of Gaia. Good luck Chaos!

	13-07-2004 05:33									#215
	Remove this text

The turn has landed. I played it. Couldn't help meself and I was online.

-S

Last edited by smacksim on 13-07-2004 at 05:43

	13-07-2004 05:46									#216
	Plan of Action for 2108 Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Scout running the river didn't find a MW. FT scout now in GL, ready to attack the SLauncher. Hopefully we'll find a MW before that, as SLaunchers aren't nearly as useful to capture.

No changest to production.
PlanNets in 11 (Sliders still at 80 percent labs)

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	13-07-2004 05:51									#217
	Remove this text

I don't know if it was discussed but I would have popped that pod in the north this turn if I had permission. Everything else I would have done the same.

So, now we get to see if a spore launcher can be capured next turn. Hmmmm....Gaian artillery

	13-07-2004 05:56									#218
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Well it's too late now since were no longer in position but....why aren't we popping that northern pod ASAP? Capturing a Spore Launcher would be fine by me and I see no reason to delay pod popping just hoping for a MW capture. We're losing turn advantage right and left.

(just my 2 cents )

	13-07-2004 06:10									#219
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Smacksim: not a problem, we have consensus on the intended turn and it doesn't take a whole lot of skill to carry it out.

	13-07-2004 06:18									#220
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Reasons to not pop the pod now:

We aren't prepared in case of mind worms

We can't take full advantage of a rush build now

We can't use resource specials, monoliths, or artifacts now, so they're just as good later.

That said, it wouldn't be a particularly bad decision to pop the pod, but there are better things to do

	13-07-2004 06:21									#221
	Put an end to popups!

Proposal:

Move scout west on river

Begin solar panel

Capture/kill spore launcher

	13-07-2004 08:01									#223
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Sporelauncher targeted. But only after moving scout west along river, in case of MW. Our complex decisions made, the comittee retires to the Observation Deck.

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	13-07-2004 08:02									#224
	Support Apolyton

Are we agreed on production? We have one more slack turn to decide I think.

	14-07-2004 04:59									#225
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

The turn is available. Seems Chaos is on ~ now most days, so I'll wait. Do you care at all who plays the turns Chaos? I mean, if we have everything decided I'm all for having whichever of us shows up play the turn.

Quite impressive 24 hour/1 turn cycle this time. We might finish by New Years.

	14-07-2004 06:18									#226
	Tired of ads?

It doesn't matter to me who actually plays the turns. I played this one.

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	14-07-2004 06:23									#227
	Plan of Action for 2109 Inflate your Upload Space

Proposal:

Pop northern fungal tower - get much-needed ECs.

Move spore launcher southeast to pop new pod - we can handle a bad pop in this position.

Use the scout there to kill/capture mind worms/spore launchers resulting from popping the pod. If none appear, move that scout patrol northeast, or post an intermediate turn and decide based on new map information. This scout will have to come back to Gaia's Landing in time for the 2112 drone.

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	14-07-2004 06:46									#228
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Spore launchers are good free drone control later on. Agree that for now, it's a better explorer than the scout (except for killing worms)

	14-07-2004 08:20									#229
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Hey, if we're ICSing we've got enough space on the river for 3 bases

I've been playing some Gaian's recently and Spore Launders seem to capture MW's just as well as MW's do.

The Spore Launcher could move E into the fungus for 1/3 movement point. Maybe we could pop the pod with the scout and if it's dangerous for him then we could cover him with the Spore Launcher. Otherwise, we move the Spore Launcher E.

I think both bases should build CP's. I feel much better since the capture.

Last edited by Net Warrior on 14-07-2004 at 08:34

	14-07-2004 08:22									#230
	Suffering from ads?

We could put one at either end and fill in the middle last, if we want that tight of base spacing. It'll be nice to get some river energy soon...well, 15 turns or so. Ack we've had a bit of a slow start. No matter.

	14-07-2004 19:32									#231
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Turn's back.

The danger of moving the spore launcher, then the scout patrol is that a bad pop would force us to recall our former, again. A safer way of doing this would be to move the scout patrol to the pod first, then zip the spore launcher through fungus if it's safe, guard the HQ if mind worms appear next to it, or attack mind worms not next to the HQ.

I'm wholeheartedly for dropping bases on the river, but should we do that with the first CP from HQ? It's a 4-turn hike to the nearest part of the river, which isn't unreasonable, but we might find something nicer to the east.

It occurs to me now - why aren't we building a CP in base #2? IIRC, we have one more turn until we pass the 10 mineral threshold, and at 2 surplus mins and nuts, we'll grow before we finish the CP (necessitating either a doctor or police for a few turns).


We need to resolve these decisions before we have consensus:

What to move onto the pod: scout patrol, or spore launcher (or nothing)?

What to build in base #2: former or colony pod?

Last edited by Chaos Theory on 14-07-2004 at 20:56

	15-07-2004 00:01									#232
	Support Apolyton

Agree on pod-popping plan
Agree on switch to CP at FT

Turn is ready to play. I don't think we need a mid-turn save either. Trust to Chaos Theory.

Last edited by smacksim on 15-07-2004 at 01:51

	15-07-2004 02:36									#233
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Pop the pod with the scout and if he finds danger than cover him with the spore launcher. If there is no danger then move the spore launcher E into the fungus which should cost 1/3 movement point. Hopefully there will be more fungus after that.

Build CVp's at both bases.

Attack the fungal tower.

	15-07-2004 04:02									#234
	Plan of Action for 2110 Full PM-box? Change here!

We can risk exploring with the injured scout, even to the point of popping the pod east of it.

Spore launcher needs to explore Uranium Flats.

Southern scout needs to return to Gaia's Landing for police.

Decisions:
Should we spend our new horde of cash to rush buy a colony pod in Gaia's Landing, once it grows, wait for base #2, or save it for Planned (~9 turns away)?

How long until we take advantage of the Uranium Flats? Its nearest tile is 4 from HQ, and there aren't many good spots for bases between that and HQ. We can either plant an intermediate base, then found one in the Uranium Flats, skip some land, or ignore the flats for a while.

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	15-07-2004 04:20									#235
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Ah, finally, some luck!

I'm for rushing the CP at GL. Population advantage greater than advantage of waiting 3 or so turns and then having Planned guaranteed. Who knows, maybe we'll find more EC's by then anyways.

Where to plant the third base? This is really a serious question now. The upside is that all directions are desirable. Considering we don't yet have a Nutrient bonus anywhere for making CPs, I'm leaning on moving the new CP southwest, unless the SLauncher discovers a rolling rainy in the flats.

Getting a 3rd base planted pronto and starting another CP is the most important thing IMO. Soon after, the FT base will produce a 4th CP, which can obviously head to the river. But we will need to consider pre-terraforming from that point on unless we find some nutrients.

Our former is making a solar right now. I think that damns our plan to road to a base site for turn advantage. So let's re-evaluate turn advantage for moving upcoming CPs, and take into consideration rush-buying our 4th CP as well, which is possible. While it is nice to get our energy production going, we will never be #1 in tech, at least not for a long while. Rather, let's focus on reaching our b-drone base limit and then terraforming the **** out of our patch of planet. Each base affords another former or two.

The trade off then becomes: Build a former first at a new base, or build a scout and then a CP? I don't have an answer because each has turn advantage of one sort or another. I do believe that building a former first is better in the long run. That's a few more turns that it'll be active while a CP is being built. Hopefully we'll find more spore launchers or worms for garrisons, which will allow us to build CPs without incurring any support.

As for a plan of action, agree that IndScout can continue exploring/trolling/popping wounded until 2115. Not as confident in our spore launcher popping pods or trolling fungus, but we need to know if there's a +2 nutrient tile over there pretty soon. The rush-built GL CP should move SW nonetheless I think. Base site in 3, and possibly a road for the first move.

	15-07-2004 06:13									#236
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Wow, all of a sudden I'm going to turn into the conservative player? I think we need to heal up the northern scout. Move him NW-SE-SE next turn. He gets to explore a bit while heading for FT. Then it's S and S, and healing in FT.

The spore launcher can move E along the river or along the fungus. I'll defer to the turn player on which to choose.

The southern scout should move W-W and pop that pod. He'll be within 1-2 squares of GL for security, and the former can always run to GL in another emergency (which is less likely to occur now). Further, we can turn a worker into a doctor at GL for 1 turn just before the base grows. I think we have to pray for something good and make that tradeoff.

Regarding base placement, if you take a look at my latest map posted in The Gaia Thread you'll see there probably isn't much land to the SW. I think base #3 belongs in the Uranium Flats in that river and can be planted in 5 turns of completion. From there that newest pod will be inside city limits and ripe for popping.

If we rush the base we don't have time to road and we spend all out EC's. I say don't rush it, at least not initially. Let's do the math and see how far we can road if we don't rush. Maybe the turn advantage loss will by mininal and we'll keep our EC's for the Planned SE switch.

	15-07-2004 06:29									#237
	Increase Your PM Length

Some paths for discussion. There is a possible base site towards the Flats to the NE of GL. I still support our IndScout taking a tour. How many turns till our Southern Scout could be at GL to prevent having to use a doctor-drone-queller?

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	15-07-2004 07:09									#238
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To pop the pod SW of GL, GL would have to have a doctor for 2 turns (4 nut + 2 min loss). Hmmm, now I'm not so sure that's a good idea.

If the Ind Scout tours, then what happens if a MW shows up near FT----we lose---game over. Besides once healed, the Ind Scout can stay near by FT while probing the local fungus.

I did some math. We'll never have enough time to road for base #3. It would be nice to plant them base-space-space-base, and the location NE would give a worker access to a 1-1-2 tile + a pod within city limits. That's not as good as planting the base in that river square instead and that would only take 2 more turns. But, I'll defer to the rest of you on base placement except I don't think SW is the right direction.

However an alternate plan would be to move the southern scout directly to GL, rush the pod, and use him to escort the CP SW and pop that pod along the way. Just don't ask were we get the EC's for the Planned SE switch.

	15-07-2004 07:39									#239
	Increase Your PM Length

I'm alright with the IndScout moving to FT then. I do think we should rush the GL CPod, no matter where we are going. The Spot I point out NE is nice because yeah, it's base-space-space-base, but it's also 2 turns closer, no fungus crossings, and has access to some nice tiles. The sooner the better

	15-07-2004 07:45									#240
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We can pop the pod with the former, when it finishes its solar panel. It should be 2113 or sooner, so the worms will still attack at 1/3 strength, making it an even fight between the former and a worm, should we find one that we can't kill from Gaia's Landing. The cumulative odds of finding such a worm and losing to it are pretty slim.