09-08-2002 02:33									#301
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Anyway, we all know that the real reason parents get kids circumcised is to avoid having to teach them how to wash their winkies. It must be awful to discuss penises while looking your wide-eyed and wondering son in the face.

	09-08-2002 02:33									#302
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui All I'd say is don't get too cocky. You wouldn't want to be a single mother raising that kid, would you?

I'm going to ignore all the nasty things you are implying about me AND my husband, and just tell you one thing. I am strong willed, my husband is not. He is smart, but even he acknowledges that I am smarter. I think he's very mature for deferring to me when he is not sure whether I am right yet. I think it is more a proof that we work well together, not vice versa.

	09-08-2002 02:34									#303
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Foreskins are great. You can hide chips and stuff in them.

	09-08-2002 02:35									#304
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Ron-- I think your real secret is a small penis.

Asher-- Show me the ongoing full term statistically supported study that supports your thesis and I'll look at it.
Simple fact is, the research is too young to prove anything either way...that kind of research requires years of controlled experimentation. We're both supporting different sides of a thesis--yours just happens to have less relevance to me and vice versa.

As I said before, that's not going to keep me up at night.

	09-08-2002 02:35									#305
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In fact, I love my schmuck. I'm going to get "Gucci" tattooed on it. Try doing that on an exposed bell-end without screaming for your mother.

	09-08-2002 02:36									#306
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"And I might view their interference in the same light. I hate to use Seinfeld's Guide to Relationships, but I have the upper hand!"

Wow.

Ever heard of picking your battles?

I guess I don't agree with your first post that circumcision or not is a very important decision. It's worth about as much discussion as you pay for the procedure. About $100. Logic dictates that its no big deal either way.

"I just need to help him sort through his religious/atheistic feelings and elminate his illogical throwbacks."

Be careful what you eliminate.

	09-08-2002 02:37									#307
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You can pull them over your thumb and make it look like Mr Thumb is wearing a swimming cap.

	09-08-2002 02:38									#308
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quote: Originally posted by SuperSneak Asher-- Show me the ongoing full term statistically supported study that supports your thesis and I'll look at it.

If a study is ongoing, it's not complete.

http://www.acsh.org/publications/pr...904/circno.html

quote: Moreover, the results of combining the data from the 28 published studies comparing HIV status to circumcision indicate that circumcision puts a man at a significantly higher risk of HIV infection.

	09-08-2002 02:38									#309
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You've given this too much thought, Laz.
Please spare us the illustrations.

	09-08-2002 02:40									#310
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I love circumcision threads. They always degenerate into "How dare you accuse me of abusing my kids!".

Time for a pro-snip post. Abolish willie-trimming and the pork scratchings industry will be destroyed.

	09-08-2002 02:42									#311
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Here's one I saw on "Puppetry of the penis". Whilst your dobber is hanging down, take hold of each side of your foreskin and pull downwards.

Your tummy banana is now doing an impression of the Eiffel Tower.

	09-08-2002 02:42									#312
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quote: Originally posted by SuperSneak You've given this too much thought, Laz. Please spare us the illustrations.

Emperor in the land of the one-eyed........fitting for this topic, I think.

	09-08-2002 02:42									#313
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Asher, as you noted in your refutation of pro-circumcision, the studies have not been done long enough to warrant either side's stance.
I picked one...deal with it.

	09-08-2002 02:42									#314
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Asher, unless, for example, dilerious rich mommies can be shown that their baby is not being hurt, someone could come along and make a fortune with baby anesthesia, so there is probably a huge market for something like this.

Also, it might be impossible for them to "feel" anything for the same reason it's impossible to put them under, just because something in them in undeveloped. Otherwise they would feel something, and we could just use smaller doses or slower absorbing anesthetics just like on a small child. This, of course, is just a guess.

Too bad I am not going to research it.

	09-08-2002 02:42									#315
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quote: I'm going to ignore all the nasty things you are implying about me AND my husband, and just tell you one thing. I am strong willed, my husband is not. He is smart, but even he acknowledges that I am smarter. I think he's very mature for deferring to me when he is not sure whether I am right yet. I think it is more a proof that we work well together, not vice versa.

I'm sorry, but I belong to this culture and you don't! You can think it nasty, but I've seen it. If your husband is waffling over whether to be more religious, there is a good chance HE WILL BE. The culture is simply too strong. Unless he is totally against his religion and culture and will never even think about being religious (like I am), the traditions will probably suck him in. I've seen where a man had a religious revival and then wanted to raise the kids Muslim, and when the wife disagreed, he left her.

Sorry if I was trying to give you some advice. Not like I don't know how Muslim culture is or anything

And furthermore, he is a man that seems to defer to you on everything. How long do you think it'll be before his buddies tell him to stand up for himself. And then when do you think you will do when suddenly he gets a backbone?

	09-08-2002 02:44									#316
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Right. Anyone still taking this seriously gets a PM'd picture of me doing the stuff I've listed above.

No further warnings, you worthless scum.

	09-08-2002 02:45									#317
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Eroberer: I don't think there's any basis for anything you've been saying. If the baby's don't feel a thing why is their cry so very very high pitched?

quote: Asher, as you noted in your refutation of pro-circumcision, the studies have not been done long enough to warrant either side's stance. I picked one...deal with it.

Out of 28 available studies, you picked one of the few which said circumcised men are less vulnerable to HIV. So that was good enough for you.

Is it bugging you now that you hear the whole story?

You picked a side, Sneak, that doesn't mean it was the right one. And real men can admit when they've made a mistake.

	09-08-2002 02:45									#318
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Sh1t! In the time it took me to write a line there were like 10 posts!

	09-08-2002 02:47									#319
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quote: Originally posted by SuperSneak The bottom line to all of this is that this is a grown up decision. I find it abhorrent that you would come to a gaming site and ask the opinions of a bunch of people with no real life experience, especially in relation to the specific topic.

If you had read what I said, I said the reason I asked was precisely because I want to know what people with real life experience being men think about it.

quote: I did my research 13 months ago and engaged medical professionals in my decision. Perhaps you might consider that as an option? I certainly wouldn't defer to any opinions here...

No, why should I listen to you? You're just some guy on a gaming site, right? Besides that, you're a bigot, and you don't use logic.

And I have something to say about your immunization stance. I was never immunized until I went into the Army. I never had any of those childhood diseases. My older brother, who was immunized, did. He also almost died from spinal meningitis shortly after a round of immunizations. However, I realize this is not conclusive proof, and I will do the research myself, but I'm certainly not going to do it because someone else says I should.

Listening to logic is not "deferring." It's making up my mind on my own, which is more than anyone can say for you. I don't give a damn about anyone's "real life experience" unless it is relavent, and most of the people who have posted do have relavent experience anyway.

	09-08-2002 02:50									#320
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quote: Originally posted by Ron Jeremy Right. Anyone still taking this seriously gets a PM'd picture of me doing the stuff I've listed above. No further warnings, you worthless scum.

It's almost worth starting to take it seriously.

	09-08-2002 02:53									#321
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Asher, I have no clue, I didn't know know that they cried really loud, but I am still of the opinion that the operations do not effect babies. Don't worry about responding to me anymore, btw, just to let you know.

	09-08-2002 02:54									#322
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I voted No, it seems like an unnatural thing to do. If the boy could talk I think he would vote no too.

	09-08-2002 02:54									#323
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quote: Originally posted by DanS Wow. Ever heard of picking your battles?

Yes, and I think this is important, especially because it's not me who has to live with it, it's my son.

quote: Be careful what you eliminate.

Well, that's really his choice, I just want to help show what is reasonable, what is not, where he is getting his opinions, etc.

	09-08-2002 02:56									#324
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BTW: It is very rare in Denmark and in the rest of Europe too I think.

	09-08-2002 02:56									#325
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OK, Tandee...it's pretty obvious you just wanted others to rationalize the decision you already had made. You succeeded! Good for you!
As far as bigots go, your bigotry toward your own husband's religious background is evidence enough for me that you don't know jack! Maybe you should think about what this means to him? Is it his child? I'd think he'd love the fact you came here instead of speaking with him and your doctor about it.
Oh, I forgot, you don't believe in educational institutions, so you must be one of those "doctors are bad" people too.
Hope you never saw your arm off and need medical attention.

And feel free not to immunize your kids...I'm sure Asher has plenty of solid evidence against that as well.
As far as relevance, I'd think that parents who have gone through the same experience would seem fairly relevant, unless you were some backwards neck who is easily impressed by teenagers using fancy web links that make you go "oooh...oooh...web link...must...be...true".

Take your time on that immunization "research"...I'm sure MMR and all that other fun stuff will wait patiently for you to make up your mind.

What a twit.

	09-08-2002 02:57									#326
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What a big man you are, Sneak, what a big man!

	09-08-2002 02:58									#327
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**** yourself.

	09-08-2002 02:58									#328
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quote: OK, Tandee...it's pretty obvious you just wanted others to rationalize the decision you already had made. You succeeded! Good for you!

And spot on about taking the husband into account. Tandee, you sound like you really don't respect your husband that much and that ain't gonna be good in the long run, especially when he gets bitter about it.

	09-08-2002 03:01									#329
	Got spare money?

How can you respect the husband's religion when he himself doesn't respect it?

He waffles back and forth between believing in it, he drinks, has premarital sex...

And I think it was fairly obvious she was open to input. It's just that the overwhelming scientific and logical reasoning behind it, as well as most of the world, points to circumcision as being a useless relic of old religion.

And since she's not going to raise her son to be muslim, she doesn't need to have him circumcised.

Why would you insist she circumcise her son? Imran says something about the boy may end up being muslim later in his life and getting circumcised. Sneak quoted the typical HIV stuff which as been debunked dozens of times already in this very thread.

Is it any wonder she chose not to cut off his foreskin?

	09-08-2002 03:04									#330
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quote: How can you respect the husband's religion when he himself doesn't respect it?

Not just the religion. She says in arguments she gets her way because she's strong willed and he's not. She likes to roll all over him. I have a sneaking suspicion that she dumped ck, because he stood up for himself.

quote: Why would you insist she circumcise her son?

I'm not. I'm presenting an alternate viewpoint to everyone here. I don't care if she doesn't or does. Just telling her some of the cons to it.

But Asher, you only hear what you want to, so I'll let you go off and keep doing that.