05-10-2002 20:13									#301
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Progress score:

Gloucester 23
Saracens 11

5 minutes into the second half.

I couldn't get audio on the Leicester -v- Bath match. Presumably Leicester is losing and Havak has pulled a fuse out of the fuse box.

	06-10-2002 04:32									#302
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Stade Toulousain 39 - Béziers 19

The Stade Toulousain has recovered some of its prestige, this is still not the "Great" Stade but it is far better than the two previous weeks. The Stade's melee has been good and has dominated its opponent, I fear the Tigers will make Béziers' forwards bite the dust...

We have seen some pretty good attacks and a few fumbles, but the game of the Stade Toulousain has greatly improved. Will it still be the case next week against the London Irish ? Nobody knows...

	06-10-2002 04:37									#303
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quote: Originally posted by Caligastia

Thanks for the red card Caligastia, MrWhereItsAt is red carded, next stage... figure skating.

	06-10-2002 04:41									#304
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quote: Originally posted by finbar The Dutch play it - why don't the French?

But THEY are playing at this game and its even the major sport in France and in Europe, it is everywhere, almost everyday on TV or on the radio, its awful, awful...

	06-10-2002 19:34									#305
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quote: Originally posted by Tamerlin Thanks for the red card Caligastia, MrWhereItsAt is red carded, next stage... figure skating.

... followed by synchronised swimming ...

... followed by having to watch a game of L***** ...

From which there is no return!

	06-10-2002 19:42									#306
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quote: Originally posted by Tamerlin Stade Toulousain 39 - Béziers 19

Other full-time scores of interest to this thread. Or at least a couple of us:

Gloucester 44
d
Saracens 14

**
Leicester 22
d
Bath 20

Bath came home with the proverbial damp-ish sail. Did the bell save Leicester?

	07-10-2002 12:41									#307
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quote: Interesting how that fraudulent, last-minute Dan Luger non-try seems to have dissolved in history's melting pot.

History records that you lost. Terrible shame eh?
Any complaints about last year then?

quote: Substitute England for Auckland and Twickers for Eden Park and you're sounding worrying like you-know-who.

I have no idea who you mean. Did I mention Saturday was Tigers 50th straight home win in the league?
Okay let me be honest – we have problems. I can finger one – we have a stand off who cannot play in that position. The coach has to get a grip and tell Oz he is not playing there. And we are in the market for one – know of any going guys?

I think also the confidence has been dented by the start to the season and perhaps bizarrely the summer off has had an effect – I don’t think the lads have their head in the right place yet, they need more rugby.

Why am I so worried? We dominated possession but could not find the cutting edge the entire first half, our only points coming from a trade-mark pushover. In the second half they tightened up the game, ditching the silly punting game plan and driving through the forwards and, for 38 mins, dominated the game and slowly put points on the board. At 78 mins we were 22-6 up and cruising to an easy win.

What do you do in that position? Me I would stick the ball up my jumper. Austin kicked the pill in a chip and go that was intercepted by Kevin Maggs and bang – Bath have a lifeline. Not content with this stupidity Austin then switched the restart when his team mates were clearly not ready for it giving Bath the pill and the numbers and they used it well. Two minutes, two stupid decisions, and a game that was easily won nearly lost.

I am positively annoyed with him!

Still, and Finbar you will like this, after their second try Oz got into a barny under the posts and was yellow carded along with one of their players with only 30 seconds to go. Stimmo took the restart which was nice , deep and safe and the forwards muched up and kept Bath in their half. A get out of jail card thanks to the lip’s sin binning.

We now start the first European phase with an away game to Neath. Wales is a hard place for English clubs, the word ‘cauldron’ is not inappropriate, and I have massive doubts as to whether they can get anything from that. But I will finally cry if we lose the next weeks fixture which is at home to an Italian side. We haven’t got quite that bad just yet.

I see Sarries were easily cast aside as per my prediction. Who can stop Glaws now I wonder?

Nice to see you get a good win Tamerlin. I hope we can repeat it. London Irish are not playing well so I think you might have a nice surprise next week.

	07-10-2002 13:55									#308
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quote: Originally posted by Havak History records that you lost. Terrible shame eh?

I suppose you take a win however you get it.

quote: Did I mention Saturday was Tigers 50th straight home win in the league?

Well, let's say you fell in.

quote: Okay let me be honest – we have problems. I can finger one – we have a stand off who cannot play in that position. The coach has to get a grip and tell Oz he is not playing there.

This is the player with the groin injury that was going to keep him out of the Tests? What an astonishing recovery.

Oh, and grow your own stand offs!

quote: I see Sarries were easily cast aside as per my prediction. Who can stop Glaws now I wonder?

Tom's bankruptcy, probably.

	07-10-2002 14:50									#309
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quote: Originally posted by Tamerlin About Ravagon, is infringement of the Apolyton Rugby thread rules is very serious, I think a red card is the least we can do as he is even encouraging a So... So... Soc... (sorry, I can't write it) team.

Aaahh but what you haven't considered is that by supporting one team I am, in reality (or what passes for reality where I'm concerned anyway ) actually opposing the other 50-odd teams. That has to count for something surely...

Besides which, my sporting intake lately, when I can spare a moment, has been limited to (i) S***** (for the benefit of Tamerlins delicate sensibilities ) ~ 6 hours on SBS each Sunday.
(ii) TGTPIH ~ 0 hours.
Didn't manage to catch the mighty Auks versus those Otagoan plonkers either.

	07-10-2002 14:52									#310
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quote: I suppose you take a win however you get it.

That’s the nature of the game. It’s not too difficult to find examples of you doing the same, as in winning against the run of play. Take your home game to Caligastia’s lads this year.

quote: Well, let's say you fell in.

quote: What an astonishing recovery.

Miraculous.

quote: Oh, and grow your own stand offs!

We try. Vesty is okay but the Bristol thugs did for him. Did I mention they booed as he was carried off. Disgraceful behaviour for a Union crowd, but then again Bristol’s crowds are getting terrible anyway. Keep your fingers crossed the Ryan effect does not take hold at Glaws.

In other news Wilko’s younger brother in his second senior game for Newcastle made an appalling error that gifted the oppo a try. I bet that wetn down well with Big Bro?

quote: Tom's bankruptcy, probably.

That’s a dilemma for me. Glaws have bought their squad but there are finally some good young English players coming through their academy which Tom also bank rolled. On the former I am happy for them to fail, but the latter might help my country. Tricky.

You may have heard the Kronfeld rumour – apparently going to Wasps as he can’t nail a starting place with us. He is very popular with the lads and apparently the team stayed behind for several hours Saturday for a farewell to Josh party.

I don’t blame him to be honest, he was very unlucky he signed just as Moody was breaking into the scene.

	07-10-2002 15:01									#311
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quote: Originally posted by ravagon Aaahh but what you haven't considered is that by supporting one team I am, in reality (or what passes for reality where I'm concerned anyway ) actually opposing the other 50-odd teams. That has to count for something surely...

In a word - absolutely not in any way, shape or form!

quote: Besides which, my sporting intake lately, when I can spare a moment, has been limited to (i) S***** (for the benefit of Tamerlins delicate sensibilities ) ~ 6 hours on SBS each Sunday. (ii) TGTPIH ~ 0 hours.

You really know how to dig yourself into a hole, huh?

quote: Didn't manage to catch the mighty Auks versus those Otagoan plonkers either.

And you're a better person for it!

	07-10-2002 15:07									#312
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quote: Originally posted by Havak That’s the nature of the game. It’s not too difficult to find examples of you doing the same, as in winning against the run of play. Take your home game to Caligastia’s lads this year.

That wasn't a win against the run of play. We led, they came back, we came back and won.

quote: We try. Vesty is okay but the Bristol thugs did for him. Did I mention they booed as he was carried off. Disgraceful behaviour for a Union crowd, but then again Bristol’s crowds are getting terrible anyway.

Bristol crowds turning into thugs ... John Major turning into a stud ... what's the world coming to?

quote: In other news Wilko’s younger brother in his second senior game for Newcastle made an appalling error that gifted the oppo a try. I bet that wetn down well with Big Bro?

Poor kid. Where does he play?

quote: You may have heard the Kronfeld rumour – apparently going to Wasps as he can’t nail a starting place with us. He is very popular with the lads and apparently the team stayed behind for several hours Saturday for a farewell to Josh party.

He must be in the twilight, though?

	07-10-2002 15:18									#313
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Ah, ah ! It seems we have a client for figure skating, let's take the rope.

About the Stade Toulousain victory against Béziers, the score must not hide some of the team deficiencies, from time to time a lack of coordination, bad passes and handling errors have once again prevented the Stade to end good movements.

On the positive side, the forwards have done a good job and Jean-Baptiste Ellisalde as a half-scrum has delivered an impressive performance. Wait and see...

	07-10-2002 15:22									#314
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quote: That wasn't a win against the run of play. We led, they came back, we came back and won.

It’s all about perspective. I wonder what Caligastia thinks?

quote: what's the world coming to?

At least the Bristol crowd observation is a credible possibility. But Major?



Wilkos brother plays centre. He received a high pass behind his own line, dropped in and the opposition openside grabbed the score.

quote: He must be in the twilight, though?

He is 31 which on the face of it supports your point. Until one realises the incumbent openside (Neil Back) is rising 34. When Josh goes our flanker cover will revert to Corry and Martin’s brother Will Johnson.

There – I got Martin and Johnson in a sentence without meaning the man you would expect.

	07-10-2002 15:35									#315
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quote: Originally posted by finbar You really know how to dig yourself into a hole, huh?

One of these days I may learn the difference between in and out.
Today will not be that day.
My point was supposed to be that there wasn't any rugby televised in any way shape or form that I could access.
Bleeping lucky SOB's with foxtel.

quote: Ah, ah ! It seems we have a client for figure skating, let's take the rope.

Damn. Nobody thought to mention that I had the choice between figure skating or the rope.
I'll take the rope please. A lot less painful and much quicker to boot.

	07-10-2002 15:50									#316
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quote: Originally posted by ravagon Damn. Nobody thought to mention that I had the choice between figure skating or the rope. I'll take the rope please. A lot less painful and much quicker to boot.

The rope is used to tie the guilty lad to a solid chair in front of the TV.

	07-10-2002 17:48									#317
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quote: Originally posted by Havak It’s all about perspective. I wonder what Caligastia thinks?

I don't.

quote: But Major?

God Bless the Old Country. Where else could such things happen?

quote: Wilkos brother plays centre. He received a high pass behind his own line, dropped in and the opposition openside grabbed the score.

Oh well. Campo once committed a sin almost as diabolical - and in a slightly more important match - which I'm sure you will recall. It didn't stop his career.

quote: There – I got Martin and Johnson in a sentence without meaning the man you would expect.

Actually, I've got an alarm clock set. It rang just as I read your post.

	07-10-2002 17:51									#318
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quote: Originally posted by ravagon My point was supposed to be that there wasn't any rugby televised in any way shape or form that I could access.

No, your point was that you were watching ******! You're only compounding your sin!

quote: Bleeping lucky SOB's with foxtel.

The only rugger on Foxtel at the moment is delayed NPC and Currie Cup matches.

quote: Damn. Nobody thought to mention that I had the choice between figure skating or the rope. I'll take the rope please. A lot less painful and much quicker to boot.

You haven't seen our barbed wire rope which has a nice bit of stretch in it.

	07-10-2002 18:25									#319
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Speaking of Currie Cup matches – weekends like these remind me of why Rugby is still the greatest game on earth!

My team (Lions) may have lost , but what a game! In the dying minutes of the match wave upon wave of Lions attackers surged at the Cheetah’s line in an effort to score a fourth try which would have given them a second bonus point and guaranteed their place in the semis. But the Cheetahs defence held firm – a nail-biter to the final whistle. Final score: Cheetahs 29 – Lions 22.

Who needs s*****!

	07-10-2002 20:37									#320
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quote: Originally posted by Havak It’s all about perspective. I wonder what Caligastia thinks?

As much fun as it is to point out flaws in the victories of your opponents, in the end you have to accept the end result. On the bright side, errors that would have been overlooked a few years ago are now being picked up by the video ref.

	07-10-2002 20:41									#321
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quote: Originally posted by Devil of Truth Speaking of Currie Cup matches – weekends like these remind me of why Rugby is still the greatest game on earth! My team (Lions) may have lost , but what a game! In the dying minutes of the match wave upon wave of Lions attackers surged at the Cheetah’s line in an effort to score a fourth try which would have given them a second bonus point and guaranteed their place in the semis. But the Cheetahs defence held firm – a nail-biter to the final whistle. Final score: Cheetahs 29 – Lions 22. Who needs s*****!

They are showing the round 4 currie cup game here at the end of the week. I might watch it, do you know which teams will be playing?

	08-10-2002 03:57									#322
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quote: Originally posted by Caligastia As much fun as it is to point out flaws in the victories of your opponents, in the end you have to accept the end result.

Careful, Cal, you're risking a Card on two grounds: common sense; and even-handedness.

	08-10-2002 03:59									#323
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quote: Originally posted by Caligastia They are showing the round 4 currie cup game here at the end of the week. I might watch it, do you know which teams will be playing?

http://sport.iafrica.com/rugby/curr...tures/index.htm

	08-10-2002 04:04									#324
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quote: Originally posted by Devil of Truth Speaking of Currie Cup matches –

Hey DoT. The marketing people managed to make it totally impossible to work out where the South African S12 teams came from by removing any reference to their province in the team names.

Can you give us a quick rundown of the Currie Cup teams? Who they are? Where they're from?

Oh, and while you're at it - the S12 teams too?

	08-10-2002 07:54									#325
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CURRIE CUP
Western Province Stormers - Cape Town
Golden Lions - Johannesburg
Blue Bulls - Pretoria
SW District Eagles - George
Griqualand West - Kimberley
Northwest Leopards - Potchefstroom
Border Bulldogs - East London

Natal Sharks - Durban
Free State Cheetahs - Bloemfontein
Boland Cavaliers - Wellington
Mpumalanga Pumas - Witbank
Gauteng Falcons - Kempton Park
Eastern Province Mighty Elephants - Port Elizabeth
Northern Free State Griffons - Welkom

DoT can probably give you a better idea of the different teams, and how good they are, and the Super 12 teams as well, but that's where the different Currie Cup teams are from.

	08-10-2002 09:31									#326
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Thanks for that, Bearcat.

	08-10-2002 12:35									#327
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quote: Campo once committed a sin almost as diabolical - and in a slightly more important match - which I'm sure you will recall. It didn't stop his career.

Which is a shame really. A superb player but I think on balance he did Australian rugby no credit. He made everyone think you were all moaning racist sulkers. And could that have been more wrong?

quote: Actually, I've got an alarm clock set. It rang just as I read your post.

I was on schedule then?

I don’t think Caligastia was risking a red there myself but heh who am I to argue.

	08-10-2002 12:50									#328
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quote: Originally posted by Havak Which is a shame really. A superb player but I think on balance he did Australian rugby no credit.

I've long separated personal ability from personality. Good grief - Frank Sinatra was a superb singer but remained an utter ar*ehole. Campo was a freak, magical player but remains an utter idiot. I enjoy people's God-given gifts for what they are.

quote: I don’t think Caligastia was risking a red there myself but heh who am I to argue.

Common sense and even-handedness? Bah!

	08-10-2002 13:24									#329
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quote: Originally posted by finbar Can you give us a quick rundown of the Currie Cup teams? Who they are? Where they're from? Oh, and while you're at it - the S12 teams too?

The marketing boys have pretty much screwed team names up for the average South African as well . It was so much easier following a Natal vs. Transvaal match – but such are the times.

As for the Currie Cup teams, Bearcat was mostly right. Very impressive ! The teams playing, their home base, and relative strength (according to that great, omnipotent, SA-rugby guru, DoT ):

- Investec Western Province; Cape Town; Strong
- Vodacom Free State Cheetahs; Bloemfontein; Strong
- Falcons; Kempton Park; Average
- Nashua Griquas; Kimberly; Weak
- Boland Kavaliers; Wellington; Weak
- Spoornet Bulldogs; East London; Average
- Griffons; Welkom; Weak
- Natal Sharks; Durban; Strong
- Lions; Johannesburg; Strong
- Pumas; Witbank; Weak
- Blue Bulls; Pretoria; Average
- Mighty Elephants; Port Elizabeth; Average
- Vodacom Eagles; George; Weak
- Leopards; Potchefstroom; Weak


The S12 absorbs the unions into 4-regional sides. As you can guess, very few players from the really small unions actually make it to these sides, and you usually find 13 men on the field come from the same union. Here they are, name, home base and the unions they represent:

- Bulls; Pretoria; Mostly Blue Bulls
- Cats; Johannesburg; Mostly Lions, Cheetahs & Pumas (Big surprise! )
- Investec Stormers; Cape Town; Mostly WP & Griffons
- The Sharks; Durban; Mostly Sharks

	08-10-2002 14:12									#330
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So you would accept (away from stand off) that healey is a 'freak magical player' too then? He shares the ability to turn games (either way).

Okay maybe on the common sense part that warrants red - but even-handed? All he pointed out was it the score on the board that counts and that however much we whinge it stays the same.

It that way you could say he was admonishing both of us - you for the Luger 'try' and me for the Lions. Perfectly acceptable thread behaviour that then?