15-11-2003 15:45									#181
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STYOM - be my guest - we are entertaining this weekend

Stu

	15-11-2003 19:26									#182
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

12 turns apiece.

Play list:

1. Oldnslow
2. Ben Kenobi (skipped)
3. STYOM
4. SG[1]
5. Jrabbit
6. La Fayette
7. Straybow
8. duke o' york (only on Sunday mornings)
9.
...

OK, if there's no objection from Jrabbit and La Fayette (who technically could be playing this weekend), I'll play tomorrow. Unless BK responds in the interim, of course.

Last edited by Six Thousand Year Old Man on 17-11-2003 at 21:27

	16-11-2003 20:02									#183
	Suffering from ads?

Go for it, STYOM!

	16-11-2003 23:09									#184
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Playing NOW

	17-11-2003 00:07									#185
	Got spare money?

620 AD: Nothing to change. Trade is a while away.
Population now 200,000. Checking demographics, that's 6th. In fact, we are also 6th in GNP and manufactured goods... what poor SOB's are doing worse than us??

640: Siren Call founded on forested river.
Diplomat reveals Whales near Siren Call
Start moving Trireme in our core islands east; will swap Warriors on board for Settlers/Diplomat.

660: Increment a Settler in Charybdis.
Aaaaieee! Message from the Furies states that the Spanish are almost finished Magellan

680: Spanish finish Magellan I suppose we'd better aim at Mike now, or the Lady.

700: Not much, a little incrementing, a little exploring.

720: More of the same.

740: Trade; choose Literacy aiming towards Monotheism/Democracy. I'm beginning to doubt we could possibly get Mike's Chapel. Thought about Seafaring and Horse Riding, though. Some production is changed to Caravans.

Spanish start Great Library.

760: Not much.
Carthagines start Great Library.

780: Increment a little.

800: Good city site located to the west.
Macaulay rates us Hopeless.

820: Land Ho! to the east.
Trireme finished in Troy and Library started, with an eye to Xinning and shipping all our Caravans here.

840: Nomads from hut at 198,170.
Zulus are nearly finished Great Library.

860: Zulus build Great Library, all others abandon.

880: First Caravan comes on-line.

Sorry for taking the extra turn, but I wanted to see whether anyone would switch to something like Michelangelo or Statue once the Zulus finished GL.

Notes for my successor:
1. The Trireme to the east has Settlers and a Diplomat on it; I haven't found any AIs or anywhere worth founding, yet.
2. I was planning on founding with the Nomads near the 2 whales, once we get there.
3. Trireme S of Charybdis has a Caravan for Troy and a Settler to clear the Pheasant and found there.
4. Scylla will probably go into disorder next turn.
5. Once irrigation is finished near Argo, I was planning on putting workers on the grass so that Argo will hit size 2 again before the 2nd Settler is built.

All of which you are free to (and probably will ) ignore.

Good luck.

Attachment: od_a880.sav
This has been downloaded 5 time(s).

	17-11-2003 18:35									#186
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No Magellan???

	17-11-2003 18:58									#187
	Increase Your PM Length

Don't worry about it!
After a hesitant start, we are in much better (if not great yet ) shape, and have found land to both the east and the west. We can always capture Magellan as it will prove very useful to us and our efforts at conquest on a map this size. For the time being, we should concentrate on making up the tech shortfall, and Mike's will allow us an easy transition to representative governments.

	17-11-2003 19:45									#188
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I messaged Ben Kenobi about this game on Friday and got no response...

So we'll skip Ben, and call it Stu's turn...

	17-11-2003 23:14									#189
	Full PM-box? Change here!

OK - have d/led - probably play tomorrow...
still have to find time for Sticky............

Stu

	18-11-2003 16:07									#190
	The Approach of Communism Increase Your PM Length

0880 = Sliders to 0.7.3 to induce celebration in Troy and avert Scyllan unrest, Scylla production shifted to Temple; HutFinder invoked to locate goodies, Eastern explorers sense nearby hut;

0900 = Sliders back to 1.4.5; Troy celebrating, Library transformed to Market Place, Scylla now size 4 and OK; Hut Ho to the West - Literacy;
0920 = Zulus start Leo's ; Seafaring selected; Hut to East - Horseback Riding; The Institute founded on the Pheasant - because I shall be spending a lot of time there I think...; Sparta founded to West - only one Whale but this has to be ICS time; Lose celebration now extra cities exist ; Slider to 1.2.7
0940 = Lighthouse goes POP! Colonies are on their own for a while; Western Fleet of Exploration reports it is 'near Ulundi'; Athens founded;
0960 = Seafaring->The Republic; Troy builds Market Place; Hut - Masonry;
0980 = all quiet
1000 = Hut - 25g; allows a little tickling;
1020 = Hut - Construction;
1040 = Carts start Leo's;
1060 = Zulu sighted;
1080 = Bridge Building stolen from Hlobane; Outraged Zulus declare war ;
1100 = Settler joins Troy now size 6; Copper(d), Circe-Troy, 84g; Troy starts Colloseum;
1120 = Chinese starts Ike's; Mongols start Leo's; The Republic->Banking;

... and just as a plan starts to come together, one's turns are over .
Mandatory advice to be ignored by the next player: Our Western colony will continue to spew out Settlers for self expansion and Diplomats for borrowing the knowledge of the great Zulu nation; Ulundi is known to be just to the SW of Hlobane and the road system suggests there are more cities to the NE; If this can net us Engineering, the Lady is just around the corner. Our Eastern colony is only embrionic at the moment, but expansion is about to start, we have enough space, we can GROW!
At home, demanded caravans are being delivered, for the money and beakers, undemended ones are being stored for The Lady - Communism here we come!!!!!!!

Attachment: od_a1120.zip
This has been downloaded 5 time(s).

	18-11-2003 16:23									#191
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Don't forget to hug the coast!!!

Stu

	18-11-2003 16:55									#192
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

We don't have time on our side, but inspired hut popping and theft means that we're not doing too awfully in the tech race at the moment. The statue will be valuable as Stu said, but for different reasons as far as I'm concerned. She'll mean we can spend time in fundy, democracy and commie with seamless changes (unless all the troops are based in one city) and can build up different areas of our empire in turn.
then then ....

	18-11-2003 17:05									#193
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Theft is to be preferred to hut popping for two reasons - it doesn't dry up with Invention and we are not restricted to getting things for which we have the prereqs...
You try running this 'empire' as a representative gov!!

	18-11-2003 18:09									#194
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

I wasn't planning to "run" it, just to whack up the population for a few turns and then mercilessly subject the people to the iron fist they thought they had been freed from.

	18-11-2003 19:34									#195
	Inflate your Upload Space

Good looking turns Stu

I think Republic/Demo could help to grow us a bit... but certainly these are not a long term solution (conquest game, no happy wonders so far).

Build some harbours, get a WLT*D going in Republic/Demo, grow the cities to size 8+, and get better trade bonuses in Commie.

In the continued absence of BK, Jrabbit is next.

	18-11-2003 19:57									#196
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

BK is still posting, but I think his turns as the Demo game President are taking up most of his Civ time.

But as Winston Churchill never said: "The Demo game is the worst form of Civ 2 except for all those others that have been tried".

	18-11-2003 19:59									#197
	:cool: Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

quote: Originally posted by Six Thousand Year Old Man Good looking turns Stu

Agreed.

quote: I think Republic/Demo could help to grow us a bit... but certainly these are not a long term solution (conquest game, no happy wonders so far). Build some harbours, get a WLT*D going in Republic/Demo, grow the cities to size 8+, and get better trade bonuses in Commie.

Hmm. Wondering about growth potential in an archipelago sans Happy WoWs.
We shall see...

quote: In the continued absence of BK, Jrabbit is next.

Happy to play. Wonder where the Jedi has gone. I know he's busy in C2DG, but he usually posts his regrets @ +1...

Download complete. And since LOTR Twin Towers Extended DVD hits the stores today, I know my girls will be ensconced tonight and I shall have unfettered access to the comp!

Please post further Advice To Ignore in the next 6 hours. I want to be fully prepared to do what I damned well please...

	18-11-2003 20:17									#198
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

My advice is to build the Statue as soon as possible and then get any miscellaneous wonders, though I doubt any will be left. Don't get suckered into building Mike's and missing Statue.

IMO celebrations in representative governments won't be feasible until we have many trade routes in place. So if we do build SoL, we should switch to Communism and sit tight for a bit.

Also... now that we have Horse Riding... perhaps we should build a few of those for exploration and especially home defence. We're only a Barb Caravel full of Knights away from being capital-less.

	18-11-2003 20:26									#199
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

On the Barb front, we have IIRC nearly enough units in Troy to baulk any landing - and as the 'vans come home we shall then be safe - from that fear at least ...
Oh - I agree, The Lady is more important than Mike's.

Stu

	18-11-2003 20:26									#200
	ADVICE to IGNORE Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Scouse Gits Don't forget to hug the coast!!! Stu

-Jrabbit,

Since you put it that way. Please ignore Stu's advice.

Break a leg.

Monk

	18-11-2003 20:51									#201
	RCC :D Increase Your PM Length

quote: Originally posted by Scouse Gits 0880 = Sliders to 0.7.3 to induce celebration in Troy and avert Scyllan unrest, Scylla production shifted to Temple; HutFinder invoked to locate goodies, Eastern explorers sense nearby hut;

Hutfinder It's not banned, but still...

I always forget to get my Monarchy to celebrate. Major mental block there, particularly when I consider that I always make sure Fundy celebrates.

quote: 0920 = Zulus start Leo's ; Seafaring selected; Hut to East - Horseback Riding; The Institute founded on the Pheasant - because I shall be spending a lot of time there I think...; Sparta founded to West - only one Whale but this has to be ICS time; Lose celebration now extra cities exist ; Slider to 1.2.7

I suspect you didn't irrigate the birds to buffalo in order to keep the extra food, correct? Wouldn't the production of the Buffalo get us more 'vans faster (and also getting a trade arrow from the city square)?

It might also have kept the celebration going a bit longer... oh well.

Otherwise, looks like you had some good huts, by my count we need Banking, Engineering and Invention for Democracy...

	18-11-2003 21:58									#202
	Remove this text

Yes, the growth, both of the cities themselves and of the number of cities prevented more than one turn of celebration - an opportunity missed by my predecessor. However, in rare self-critical mode, I should have eschewed Seafaring - since we can't currently afford Harbours - and gone straight for Demo techs - mea culpa

Stu

	18-11-2003 22:02									#203
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

re: Pheasant/buffalo - yes I neglected to irrigate - not only with the original Settler, but also with the one I brought down from Circe to 'b' into Troy - a matter of priorities, but you might be right ...

Stu

	18-11-2003 22:41									#204
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

quote: Originally posted by Scouse Gits Yes, the growth, both of the cities themselves and of the number of cities prevented more than one turn of celebration - an opportunity missed by my predecessor. Stu

I noticed that opportunity missed too... about a half hour after I had posted my turnlog. As noted, I miss that chance far too often.

* Six Thousand Year Old Man writes 'celebrating Monarchy' on a post-it note and places said note prominently at the top of the monitor.

	19-11-2003 20:08									#205
	Mythological Turnlog Remove this text

It's late in the year 1120 AD and a Imperator comes to power. His name? Ajaxrabbit. As king of all he surveys, he has a look around...

Overall, the Sailing Sivvans are Weak, but boast a Spotless reputation (despite our recent thievery in Zululand). Our 510,000 loyal subjects have provided a treasure of 20 GP with the bank account growing at 7 GP/turn at the current 20-70-10 tax structure. Research is on a 12 turn pace.

We are 6th in most important categories -- approval, population, GNP, mfg. goods, life expect, and income. We are 4th in land area, so there is growth potential. We are 1st only in productivity and pollution; 2nd in literacy, family sizy, and military svc. Our limited early land mass has netted a total of 9 cities with virtually no infrastructure.

Currently, we study Banking, which leaves The Wheel, Engineering, and Invention still needed before Democracy/SOL. To reach Monotheism/Mike's, we still require Mysticism, Philosophy, and Polytheism. We are at a crossroads...

Ajaxrabbit thought we were closer to paydirt. All he can hope to do is lend some positive direction to his successor. In his heart, he knows the ppl want Mike's, to allow a much-needed celebration. In his head, he knows the Statue will serve the kingdom through whatever regime changes are deemed necessary to serve the Sivvan interests.

1120/1140 AD -- Troy set to semi-xinning (3 eins) to boost beakers, Colosseum project changed to Harbor. Sliders moved to 30-70-0 (+9 GP/turn). Scylla builds Temple. We search for our triremes and diplomats, try to find a way to reach Zulus for quick research...

1160 AD -- Troy down to one food in box, goes to full xinning. Research rate now 8 turns.
--Scylla grows to size 5, completes Temple.
--Chinese switch to Adam Smith.
--Cimmeria founded on buffalo, east of Argo.
--Oedo time. with so few troops to support, Ajaxrabbit tries a million combinations for possible move to Republic. Celebrations appear impossible and corruption would outrageous, so --
NO REVOLUTION!!!

1180 AD -- Troy's gems (d) are delivered to Scylla, netting 114 GP.
--Scylla emulates Troy to set up classical alternate-xinning scenario.
--Barb frigate (galleon?) spotted in far east by Athens' wandering diplomat.

1200 AD -- Circe completes beads van, starts temple.
--We discover Banking! After much thinking, Ajaxrabbit emits a heavy sigh, selects The Wheel.
--Despite temple, WoW, and marketplace, Troy is unhappy. Colosseum rushed with our newfound wealth.
--We need camels! Scylla, Charybdis beads sitting in Troy are cashed in for 38 + 32 GP. Increments bought.

1220 AD -- Sparta completes Settler, starts warrior to accompany him.
Population = 600,000. Growth requires Elvi.

1240 AD -- Carthaginian genius Leonardo Da Vinci completes a Wonderful Workshop at Gades. Zulus, Mongols, abandon similar efforts.

1260 AD -- Back to full xinning in Troy/Scylla. Research rate back to 8 turns.
--Athens, Charybdis complete camels, Cimmeria completes horseman, Siren call a dip.
--Athens, Cimmeria start settlers. Charybdis, Siren Call start temples.
--In a bold move, Ajaxrabbit loads Athenian camel onto trireme sailing for home islands.

1280 AD -- Zulus chat. we can only gape in awe as they display the art of Monotheism.
--sparta completes warrior, starts dip.

1300 AD -- Well, in for a dime, in for a dollar. Ajaxrabbit decides to try risky trireme trip to Athens with demanded goods. Political punditry abounds.

1320 AD -- We discover The Wheel, start studying Engineering.

1340 AD -- Hut yields much-need 50 GP. A few minor incremental purchases.
Temple rushed in Circe.

1360 AD -- Circe temple complete, camel started.

1380 AD -- Westbound trireme and Athenian van lost at sea. Ajaxrabbit weeps bitter tears and makes discreet inquiries re accommodations at The Institute.

1400 AD -- Ajaxrabbit realizes his turns should be over, does nothing.

1420 AD -- Eastbound trireme reaches coastline of island west of Athens. Sailors call off mutiny, prepare to deliver demanded beads and salt.

Imperator Ajaxrabbit abdicates, boards canoe bound for The Institute...

	19-11-2003 20:18									#206
	the save and addendum... Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Well, I got carried away. Had to see if one of my 2 stupid gambles would pay off. Sorry for the extra turns.

The 2 demanded camels should be delivered to Athens so as to maximize science returns and cash. In other words, don't deliver both if the 1st fills the research box. this should provide the cash boost we need to buy those much-needed increments...

Also -- somewhere in the last few turns (1360? 1380?), I founded the city of Polyphemus in a lovely sweetspot in the northwest.

Two triremes with a total of 3 diplomats are cruising slowly toward Zululand, so our techs should advance quickly.

I've burned the 2 'vans that were awaiting WoWhood in Troy. Needed the cash and science boost.

BTW, if anyone needs some appropriate city names, I jotted down a bunch of Odysseus-related proper nouns for possible use...

Again, mea culpa for the extra turns. Here's the zipped Sivvan Save for La Fayette. Fortunately, he's used to cleaning up my messes...

Attachment: od_1420a.zip
This has been downloaded 5 time(s).

	19-11-2003 21:10									#207
	Got spare money?

Trireme lost at sea?? Hopefully the returns in Athens will make the loss bearable.

I'm not sure that 70 gold/beakers was enough return for those Beads vans... we need a lot of shields to build SoL. Maybe we'd have been better off stealing techs with 30-shield Diplomats rather than spending 100 shields to get a bit closer to Wheel?

Glad you didn't go to Republic. And despite my criticisms, I think the groundwork has been laid here for a run at the SoL. If we have some luck, we may be able to grab 2 of Engineering/Invention/Democracy. All 3 would be ridiculous luck (and we don't know that the Zulus even know Demo); 2 of 3 would be a very good result, 1 of 3 would be the bare minimum of success. (If we don't manage to steal anything that works towards SoL, we may be totally out of luck; the beaker requirements for research would be even higher). Do we have an embassy with the Zulus, which would let us see what's available to steal?

La Fayette is up...

	19-11-2003 21:13									#208
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Hey - it's not as if you lost half of our cities or gave away a massive tech lead (though in this game you'd be some kind of miracle worker to achieve the latter )!

Those were some decent turns, without looking at the save file.


*duke considers the possibility of getting some turns in this weekend, but is happy to let BK play if he wants back in the rota after being skipped*

	19-11-2003 21:24									#209
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by duke o' york *duke considers the possibility of getting some turns in this weekend, but is happy to let BK play if he wants back in the rota after being skipped*

Well, it's Wednesday... assuming La Fayette plays in the next couple of days, you could probably play on the weekend. Depends on the availability of Straybow and BK (BK seems to be focusing on the Demogame). If one or both of them come back, you might be waiting until next weekend.

	19-11-2003 21:27									#210
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

AAAaaaarrrrrgggghhhhhh!