09-01-2003 06:11									#301
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I concur with Beta. There is no need to build a road at the future city site itself...and if the worker builds a road on the hills where our warrior is at, it will help our quick expansion southwards plus the worker will be guarded by the warrior, just in case GS gets antsy and does a surprise attack.

	09-01-2003 23:51									#302
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OK I took your advice about the worker. I have screenshots sent out.

We have made official contact with Lux Invicta. And we have discovered the borders of Gathering Storm. I knew we had to be getting close. They also have a 5th warrior visible.

	10-01-2003 06:37									#303
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Are we going to be pulling our 2 southern-most warrior back? Or see how much we can push them?

I believe that if we continue our southward advancement while keeping GS out of the northend of the landmass - They (GS) will get fed up and either kill our two warriors and/or push to claim the isthmus...

	10-01-2003 11:38									#304
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are we all agreed on moving our warriors north and cease southern exploration?

I just want to make sure. If Eli plays the turn remind him to turn the warriors north.

	10-01-2003 11:43									#305
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edit: that won't be necessary as Beta already sent out a message.

Last edited by Dis on 10-01-2003 at 13:15

	10-01-2003 13:17									#306
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OK we have all but one vote on the tech trade. If they put up the trade next turn we should go ahead and put out Bronze working. We don't have to hit accept though. Just put it up and hit send. We can accept it the turn after.

	10-01-2003 20:56									#307
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Good point Dissident!

	11-01-2003 13:22									#308
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nothing too exciting this turn. Just put up Bronze working on the trade window. Moved the warriors north.

Still not sure what we want to do with our spearman. I moved one south for now. The other moved back onto the road.

I think the voice will grow to 3 before finishing the settler, but I don't think miller town will. But I have put him on settler anyways. We can change that later.

	11-01-2003 19:40									#309
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My suggestion for the spearmen - put one on the chokepoint. He will stay there when the city goes in. Move the other south to baby sit the worker, at least until GS moves out. His final destination would be the fish-wheat city site - if we are in agreement that that is where we want to go. And I presune the worker is extending the road south.

Also suggest that when the spearman gets to the chokepoint - at least one warrior heads back north. And eventually the second as well. They will be needed for those few turns of crowd control.

Re: Miller Town - depending on how close the growth and settler production match - I don't mind losing say one turn - but any more, I usually try and fit in a build that works. Another spearman? Would also be nice to get another worker out. We could certainly use some tile improvements (mines and roads).

With 59 gold, how's the slider looking. Will it help to accelerate research and lose a bit of gold for the next few turns?

	11-01-2003 22:47									#310
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I like Dissidents's idea about not accepting. We can say that we just accidentally click send before accept.

	11-01-2003 22:54									#311
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That may not even be a consideration - after reading GS' latest reply.

	11-01-2003 23:00									#312
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I agree Beta, I think we've stalled for as long as we can for the wheel-bronze trade. I say go ahead and accept. We will address the other tech trade at a future time.

	11-01-2003 23:12									#313
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yes we will accept next turn.

no change on the slider yet. The voice will grow to size 2 next turn, we will check it then.

	13-01-2003 10:15									#314
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2590BCE :

Trade deal accepted.
I wasnt sure about what to do with the Northern Spearman so I sent him back to The Voice.
Played with the slider. 20% sci is still optimal.
Both southern warriors were moved as neccessary.

Screenshots mailed to everyone.

	13-01-2003 12:30									#315
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I'm undecided on the spearman too . They are fairly mobile with the road, so it is not important for right now.

We need to decide what to do with our worker. I've heard to continue the road south and another suggestion to connect to the luxery. It is tempting to continue the road a few more squares south, but it would also be nice to have that luxery and not have to worry about riots anytime soon.

	13-01-2003 13:21									#316
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Couple of points:

(Eli - thanks for the gridded screen shots - very helpful)

1. is the trade deal concluded - the reason I ask is that having the wheel should reveal horses I believe. Can't see any on the screen shot.

2. worker - well, if there is general agreement that the next city site is the spot between the wheat and the fish - and it is a good spot - then I say, continue the road. I also think one of the warriors - not one of the look outs - one of the others - although the west coast look out is only one square away now (see 3) - should go claim the site now. And I do believe we need to fit another worker into the build queues sooner or later - although I agree for now that settlers have priority.

3. look outs - I think you have pulled the warriors farther back than we agreed to or needed to. When the first GS letter came out, they were talking about the mountain which is now two tiles south and a little east of our east coast warrior, and ditto for the west coast warrior. The further south we can keep them without upsetting GS, the better. We will be able to keep an eye on their expansion. At a minimum - we need to make sure we have a complete view of the width of the continent.

I suggest we may want to clarify positioning with them - particularly as they want to keep their warriors up north. Hardly seems fair.

	13-01-2003 13:43									#317
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I think you need horse riding to see horses

I'm not sure where to pull the warriors back to. I'm still trying to figure out their cartography . I might actually have to draw this on paper .

I say pull them up to the jungle. checking. they are there right now. They are about where they need to be. maybe scale a mountain for a better view. the east warrior can ascend that mountain.

	13-01-2003 14:16									#318
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The manual and all the other resource material I have say that horses show up with the wheel.

And the jungle is way too far back. We discussed, and I thought, agreed upon, this earlier. But I agree - maybe we should number the last gridded screen shot - it may help.

	13-01-2003 16:30									#319
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1) You need the Wheel for horses.

2) Beta : Mark on the maps the tiles where the warriors should stop and mail it to me or dissident. Verbal descriptions arent accurate enough.

	13-01-2003 18:04									#320
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1. Then we don't have horses - the trade is done - we now have the wheel - and no horses anywhere - damn.

2. Yup - will do. I thought it was clear. But guess not.

	13-01-2003 23:00									#321
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I could have swore the horses didn't show up until horse riding. Because in another game I had no iron so I had to go for horseman. I'll check again later.

	14-01-2003 00:39									#322
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Eli is correct - The Wheel let's you see horses. Horseback Riding allows you to build mounted warriors.

	14-01-2003 04:13									#323
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Ok, I just recieved the Map via an email from ewhitlock0409 [ewhitlock0409@rogers.com] - Who is exactly is this? Is it Dissident or is it Eli?

EDIT: Just looked at the Thread of Everything...I'm guessing it's BetaHound since he's the only one with "rogers.com" in his listed email address. Any who...

By the look of the map, I'm guessing it's for the 4th city site (after we've founded the isthmus).

I would say C6 (I think that's what it says) is a good site for City #4. In addion, I think EX would be a good spot for city #5 - However, we will have a problem with the surrounding jungle untill it can be cleared out.

Well, that's my two cents worth.

EDIT (Again): I just realized that the map was to decide where our 2 southern warriors should fortify at
Well, I say just make sure they're in the mountains for added defense and increased line-of-sight.

Last edited by Wittlich on 14-01-2003 at 04:23

	14-01-2003 04:23									#324
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Eli, Diss and all - I have sent out the last gridded screen shot, marked up (nicely I may add) for discussion via e-mail to all, including jon. (hi jon)

First - we are replaying the last turn. GS did not see where we moved our warriors - the save bummed out with Legoland - so if we want to change their position we can. If anyone thinks that this is not fair - then I am OK to go along with the move we made.

Some points about the map - the blue smudges are where the warriors started last turn. From the turn before, they were intended to go to positions 1 and A. This is what was contained in the GS letter - the keyboard moves. But that's not where they went. So starting from the blue - or if we go with last move as played - from their current positions - we need to decide on good observation spots.

If we use two warriors as observers, 1 and A are good spots. They are as far south as GS will allow us, they are on mountains, and they are the spots GS suggested.

2 is the best alternate site in the west. On the east - maybe B - which is in the wrong spot - it was supposed to be one above on the mountain.

If we only use 1, and if you look at the map we can get away with it - he would be on the mountain marked with the yellow - asterix, in the centre.

The other warrior could move to the wheat/fish city site as marked - City. If we agree that this is the next site.

My preference would be for 1 and A, but if we take the move as played, we would then have to move them south next turn. GS might not be happy - but I can explain the situation.

WHAT DO YOU THINK?

I have also marked the proposed road construction to the proposed site in question. I think we need to claim as much of the mountain territory as we can to enhance our chances at getting iron. That's another reason I like 1 and A.

If we do like the city site - and we use two warriors as observers - I would suggest that one of the spare northern workers move to the site and fortify there.

ACTUALLY - looking at the map again - the better site is one square to the SE. It gets both the fish and wheat still - and will captyre more of the mountains. Please mentally move the site. The road stays the same.

I have also included a little chart, marked Ex., as an example of how they refer to tiles in the demo game. It is handy nomenclature. So the tile due north is Ex.1, or Miller Town 1, or whatever, etc. There is also a set of numbers for the next circle of tiles out as well, but I have to check how it works.

	14-01-2003 04:25									#325
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Witt - I can't type that fast.

the ewhitlock is my wife - Eleanor - for some reason all e-mails going out are under her name. we are working on it.

	14-01-2003 04:28									#326
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"1" and "A" looks good to me for fortified lookout positions for our 2 warriors.

	14-01-2003 04:29									#327
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@ Beta

	14-01-2003 05:03									#328
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quote: Originally posted by Wittlich Eli is correct - The Wheel let's you see horses. Horseback Riding allows you to build mounted warriors.

That's a drag - literally and figuratively speaking - no horses.

	14-01-2003 07:27									#329
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Witt - hadn't been looking for another site - but yes - well how about Ex.4. Get's two grasslands squares right off the bat, is technically a coast square, lots of mountains for the iron, and with one expansion, gets the grassland on the other side of the mountain - the one on the coast cornered by the three mountains. I first though this was actually the best sight, but you're right - the other side of the mountains works better. Will still require some jungle removal, and will be a 'front-line city' but it and the other one, once they expand once, will effectively claim that part of the continent for us. Then we can back-fill. And build immortals.

Man - this is ugly terrain we are working with. Reminds me of a date I once had ...

	14-01-2003 07:31									#330
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AND - we only need to road one more jungle square (Ex.6) to connect it!!!! Brilliant.