29-06-2003 14:48									#211
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Problem with ND...
We can't stall this for much longer. I'd like to explain that in our current situation, we have to use the happiness slider to support some of our bigger cities and we need at least another luxury in addition to ND's spices in order to safely decrease the happiness slider. However, both GoW and RP have been less eager to trade luxuries with us than ND has, and this is what's keeping us from ratifying the trade agreement at the moment.
Edit: also, I'd like to apologize for not thoroughly explaining our situation regarding luxuries up until now. We believed that this was unnecessary because we were under the impression that GoW and RP are going to trade with us, but we were obviously wrong. Hopefully this situation will change promptly and we'll be able to trade with everyone.

Last edited by Shiber on 29-06-2003 at 14:56

	29-06-2003 15:46									#212
	Increase the size of your Attachments

I'd also offer to compensate them in some way, since apparently we might have screwed up some of their plans.

	29-06-2003 20:04									#213
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Can we get ND to HELP us procure another luxury? Beyond that, what's wrong with telling the world about our WW+ situation, and that ending the war with Vox is an issue?

We just want to be happy.

	29-06-2003 21:56									#214
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Do the trade, offer ND Furs or Incense (hell, both). We need friends, not spare luxuries sitting around doing nothing except reinforcing dislike for our team.

We should also offer Furs to GoW (again, maybe both) and Incense+Furs to RP. Send them the proper diplomatic messages saying we are willing to go through with the luxury trades.

	29-06-2003 23:42									#215
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quote: Originally posted by Aeson Do the trade, offer ND Furs or Incense (hell, both). We need friends, not spare luxuries sitting around doing nothing except reinforcing dislike for our team.

I agree.

quote: We should also offer Furs to GoW (again, maybe both) and Incense+Furs to RP. Send them the proper diplomatic messages saying we are willing to go through with the luxury trades.

I'm requesting permission to handle this, in order to speed up the process.

	30-06-2003 03:00									#216
	Suffering from ads?

Unless there's any objection, I will PM Borc tomorrow morning and tell him that we have ratified the deal on our side, apologize for the delay and promise to send furs accepted next turn (assuming that they will add spices on their side before accepting).

	30-06-2003 03:38									#217
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

If they add Spices, it will have to be accepted again by us right? Might be best to just give Furs to them as a gift, they accept the gift, and then send us Spice as a gift.

	30-06-2003 04:46									#218
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

FLASH: GS DECIDES TO MAKE FRIENDS

Further details at 11.

	30-06-2003 18:24									#219
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Let's do the trade.

-Arrian

	07-07-2003 20:44									#220
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Shiber - re last message to Borc - haven't we already done the WM for 20 gold deal with ND (see turn 120 thread)?

	07-07-2003 20:59									#221
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We have?

If so - OH I'M STOOOOPID!!!

	07-07-2003 21:02									#222
	Tired of ads?

I can't find the thread.
I can find 118, 119, 121, 122... but the turnthread of 120, 170 BC eludes me.

	07-07-2003 21:05									#223
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I mis-typed - it's in the turn 121 thread. The relevant post is here

	23-07-2003 15:31									#224
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That note from ND surely made my day...

quote: Next turn you will find Santiago is in our Hands. This does not need to mean war.

quote: You have a big continent all for you alone.

quote: ...this war against RP has nothing to do with you. Please stay out of it.

Tell him two words: You die!

But tell it more politely, s'il vous plait!

	23-07-2003 15:39									#225
	Suffering from ads?

Yeah, that was at best a halfhearted attempt. I assume they figured it was a lost cause and they had to do something for protocol, but c'mon give me a break. I hope they weren't seriously trying to dissuade us, that would be too sad.


I like SR's response.

Maybe something like:

darekill-

Got the PM.

This is the last chance for ND to surrender. This must be a surrender without conditions we will tell you what we want and you will obey. If you do not capitulate the war will start.

Sincerely
GS

	23-07-2003 15:40									#226
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Why do they assume that we paid Spain in order to get Santiago? Seems like a pretty bizzare assumption to me.

	23-07-2003 15:43									#227
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I don't think it is completely crazy to assume that, although they might just be viewing this as a way of offering us some cash to counter the offense of attacking 'our' city. More likely, they are just making the offer in case we bought the city off RP, so we can find some non-violent way to settle the grievance.

	23-07-2003 15:46									#228
	Tired of ads?

Yeah, they probably are at a loss as to what to do about us. They probably figured we would just gift back the city once the danger is over. And they figured that they could hold up RP's end of the contract so we wouldn't be out anything. Of course, they had that chance long ago and didn't take it.

	23-07-2003 16:08									#229
	Tired of ads?

Shall we demand that they return the money that they took when they conquered the city?

(framework)

quote: Hi Borc, Got your message, yada yada... We've received reports that your troops have plundered the vaults of Santiago, and have stolen gold that belongs to Gathering Storm. We demand that you return it by wiring the stolen gold, along with 20 gold in compensation, through Glory of War. Then we can discuss a peaceful resolution. Sincerely, Gathering Storm.

I'm not actually expecting them to comply. I'm hoping to infuriate them to make them do something stupid.
On the other hand, we might prefer to keep cool relations in PMs so that they'd get hesitations. What do you think?

	23-07-2003 16:17									#230
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I don't think we should ask for the money back.

I think we should just say that "hey you declared war on us, took our city, broke our lux deal and you think that can be mitigated by a handful of gold? Bugger off."

edit: of course, that's why I'm not an ambassador, I tend to be a bit hot headed at times.

Last edited by asleepathewheel on 23-07-2003 at 16:26

	23-07-2003 16:35									#231
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Let the units do the talking to ND now. We got what we wanted out of Santiago/Bilbao.

	23-07-2003 16:45									#232
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I think that would annoy them greatly, since they know very well that the only reason we had that city was that RP were unable to defend it, and were hoping that this trick would stop them sacking the city. Letting us get away with it would be a bad idea from NDs POV, since it just means we can do the same again whenever they threaten another city (a point GoW are going to realise fairly soon). We've made a lot of noise about Lux deals being cancellable at any time (and I'm not sure if the 1 turn notice thing was made clear with ND), so I don't think we can reasonably complain about the Lux issue.

I'm all in favour of being more direct - RP made us a good offer to help them, and unless you can make a better one, we are at war for real.

	23-07-2003 16:49									#233
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no way are we going to ask for 30 some gold, that would be just another joke. Instead, we could ask them the following:

quote: Hi Borc, yes indeed, we paid RP for defense of the city. We promised that in case the city would fall, we would not rest until we conquered all demogyptian cities. If you really want to compensate our loss, please give all your cities to us, so we can keep to our promises. That will stop the war between us and let us live peaceful thereafter, we can assure you. Kind regards, GS.

DeepO

	23-07-2003 17:04									#234
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Hmmm...
Let's not make ND angry. I get the feeling that GoW's decisions are affected, to a certain degree, by ND's opinions and vice versa (they must talk a lot, and they organized a chat after we sent that PM on short notice). Let's not annoy either... we want to be able to hamper GoW's movements, but if we get on ND's nerves, they might convince GoW to take Bilbao.

	23-07-2003 17:17									#235
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I agree Shiber, the above was meant as a joke as well. It's just that we can't send a message asking for the money back, and promise to not wage war on each other, we want this war!

DeepO

	23-07-2003 18:50									#236
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My proposed message is this:

quote: Darekill, GS has received your message indicating that ND has conquered a Stormian city. Clearly, our nations are now at war. Be advised that we will act accordingly.

Short, and to the point. No insults, no machinations.

-Arrian

	23-07-2003 18:57									#237
	Remove this text

Fine by me, Arrian.

DeepO

	23-07-2003 18:58									#238
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I think they could reasonably object to Santiago being a Stormian city as a machination. We all know what the situation is, and that it is a technical change of hands to try and dissuade them from taking it, saving it for eventual RP use (they assume) or not (for us).

Agree with the general idea though. We are at war with ND and are telling them so.

	23-07-2003 19:03									#239
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I'm unsure about this.
On one hand, we're giving them information - expect to see troops soon.
On the other hand, we can bet that this would reach GoW. And then GoW would think twice about attacking Bilbao... and hopefully reconsider their position in the GoW-ND alliance. Plus, ND might divert some units to protect its shores, fearing an Inchon.

	23-07-2003 19:13									#240
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Oh, I know the city transfer itself was a machination. No question.

I'm talking about our official diplomatic response - I don't want any further pretense. Tell it like it is.

-Arrian